Surfing - 21V

[jdj06c]

We just bought a 2001 21V riders edition in great condition and love it. The wake surf has already passed our expectations. We are beginner wake surfers (3-4 times) and this has been the first boat we have surfed behind that has been weighed for surfing (after doing some research). We put 750 lbs in the rear surf locker, 400 lbs in the surf side middle seat, 400 lbs in the walk way (between the driver seat and bow), and about 150 lbs in the tip of the bow. We set taps between 2-3. We are surfing a Triple X 5'0" Slasher.

The port side seemed bigger then the starboard side. We had 3 people in the boat positioned on the surf side w/ one on the swim deck. Attached is a pic on each side (only had pics w/ us surfing). What do you guys think? Any suggestions on weighting or setting the taps differently or do you think the above is about right. Thanks, Jason.

[Surfdad]

Those are good looking wakes. We used to have that same model boat. I think we spent 200 hours messing with weight placement and the darkside (starboard side) was always weaker than the regular side (port side). We currently have an '02 23V but use the same ballast configuration as our old 21V. I found that the bow weight and walk thru weight didn't assist with length. I was hoping it would, but if I gained 6" it was a lot. Speed adjustment helped the most and we typically go 11 to 11.2 MPH. I've also found that you can overweight the darkside. If you find that your darkside wake is easily suceptible to turning washy with course changes remove some of the stern weight.

My current setup in the pictures below is:

No bow or walk thru weight

Speed: 11 to 11.2

TAPS at 4 I adjust through the day with gas use and switch riders as it effects people ballast.

People ballast: @ 600 pounds arranged heaviest furthest back on the surf side.

Water Ballast: @ 1,200 - 1,300 pounds. Rear locker full - every nook and cranny. Under bench seat on regular side and extra fat buddy on top of darkside sac.

[jdj06c]

Surfdad, thanks for your expert advice, its greatly appreciated. I saw some footage of James a few months ago and it got me hooked on wake surfing. I'm glad I went with TIGE.

Interesting that you don't use any weight in the bow. I had originally put the 400 lb sac that I have in the walkway at the front of the bow and it seemed to cause the wave to be a lot smaller so I pulled it back in he walkway and it seemed to work ok. I will try no weight in the bow next time out and see how it works out. I thought the bow would rise too high if I didn’t have any weight up front.

The fins on my Triple X seem a bit small, James board has some long fins, I imagine longer fins will help to stay in the pocket.

I believe I read on another post that you live near Lodi, CA. Where are your favorite local spots to go to? I live in Fresno, CA and luckily I have many lakes to choose from with in a short distance (I went to 3 different lakes this past weekend). But I am thinking about going a bit further out and making a camping trip to Don Pedro in few weeks and then to the Delta at the end of the month. Do you guys go out from Nov - March? I have a full body surf wet suit so I am thinking about it…would need to go to the warmer foothill lakes.

BTW, if you have any used wake surfboards you want to get rid of, let me know.

Thanks!

[Surfdad]

We typically ride New Hogan Res...I'm hoping that we get some rain this winter, because as it is now, it won't be open next summer otherwise.

James' board uses Futures Fin boxes. Your Triple X just has wakeboard fins. There are a number of differences between the two configurations and you're right one is fin depth. Typically the base of the fin is what dictates drive. Imagine 3 foot deep, one inch wide fins it would be hard to lay on rail and so would be very stable, but that extra depth doesn't give much to push against and would create TONS of extra drag and so would wind up being a slug in terms of speed. James current fin of choice is the 3/2/1 which has a base around 4+ inches and a depth of 4.5"

Once there is snow in the Tahoe area, we typically start snowboarding, but we almost always ride through December and will ride at least one time each moth Jan - Mar, and we are back at it in April.

[jdj06c]

I just put 4.5 hyperlite landlock fins on the board which actually measures about 5.25" depth and 5.5" width base. They were the longest fins w/ the two hole setup I could find. All other long surf fins would have required me to do board modifications to install the fins. I am going to try different fin setups this weekend to see what works (e.g. 3 fins, 2 side, & 1 center) and work on my spins and see if I can get some air off the wake!

[Joeprunc]

I've never surfed behind a boat, but I can tell you from my 10+ years of surfing that, you will probably find that one single fin will be slow and unstable. If you ride just two side fins (a twin fin) your board will be quite a bit more skatie, really good for 360s. However with out the center fin your drive and stability will be less. Most people who ride twinnies ride with larger fins i.e. James riding those Futures to help with drive. And obviously all three are the most stable and easiest to produce drive.

But because behind a boat you are surfing a really really small wave and limited to the boat speed, all these philosophies may be null and void. Its always fun to head out and experiment with new setups, that's how you learn and progress.

Surfdad---have you tried to contact Futures Fins to get some different setups? I went to college with their head engineer, and Hawaii sales rep, I might be able to help out a bit. Although with the economy the way it is, I think ever 'luxury company' is hurting pretty bad.

[jdj06c]

Here are a few pics from Saturday. I was pretty happy with the size of the wake . We tired it w/ no weight in the bow and the wake was pretty close on the regular side but the pocket was not very long on the goofy side. When we added 400lbs in the walkway, the length of the pocket was significantly longer on the goofy side.

[Surfdad]

That's interesting that your darkside was significantly different than the regular side. I didn't really experience that on either of my Tige's until I swapped out my prop on the 23V. Your wake looks good!

@ Joeprunc - I called the folks at Futures once to see if we could get the clear hex material (which I think is nidiacore) in the 3/2/1's and they basically said - no. I was able to find a set on the east coast, but I guess they aren't manufacturing that combination any longer. Does Future's make up custom fins or molds? That would be interesting, if you have contact with those folks, I'd love to get access to custom fins for James.

You know, we've tested some things behind the boat and things that work well in the ocean don't always translate well behind the boat. It seems that "trial and error" is alive and well in this sport.

[Ptown]

We had 3 people in the boat positioned on the surf side w/ one on the swim deck.

You might want to reconsider having someone ride on the swim deck. RAGBoy did some carbon monoxide testing and found that without a fresh air exhaust the swim deck has the highest levels of carbon monoxide.

[jdj06c]

I meant to say one was on top of the rear locker - not the swim deck. Which is still probably not the smartest thing but it sure made a nice wake. I think we will just add another 250-300lbs on top of the 750lbs sac in the locker instead of having someone sit on top.

I plan to install the Fresh Air Exhaust soon. But with the boat weighted down so much, I believe the exhaust pipes are well under the water line...I wonder how much the CO level is reduced w/ it weighted versus not weighted.

[ImaPigDog]

I meant to say one was on top of the rear locker - not the swim deck. Which is still probably not the smartest thing but it sure made a nice wake. I think we will just add another 250-300lbs on top of the 750lbs sac in the locker instead of having someone sit on top.

I plan to install the Fresh Air Exhaust soon. But with the boat weighted down so much, I believe the exhaust pipes are well under the water line...I wonder how much the CO level is reduced w/ it weighted versus not weighted.

The FAE is designed to put the exhaust directly into the prop wash. So, the CO goes with the wash, out past the rider. Having the exhaust flow into the water may quiet the exhaust but not necessary route it away.