Disc brakes vs Drum brakes

[Tip]

I have a Dorsey trailer with Drum brakes (surge type). I have recently moved from North Carolina (relatively flat) to Washington State. Would it be worth it to convert my old Drum brakes to Disc Brakes?

I'm having some problems with one of the Drums, it gets very hot after only a short drive. I pulled everything apart and checked the bearings and they looked good. The brake pads were glazed, so I lightly sanded them and cleaned out the drum and re-installed everything. I think the pads need to be adjusted because they rub slightly when the wheel is turning but I'm not sure how far to adjust them. Does anyone know what the procedure is for adjusting Drum brakes?

[mtnsmith]

It is not too difficult, if you jack up the wheels with the brakes and put them on jack stands then on the backing plate of the brake assembly there is a little plug that should be at the top in the center that can be removed and there is a star wheel(looks like a little gear wheel) that rotates to adjust the pad placement. Here is the procedure explained a little more and what to feel for as far as drag.

http://www.metrotrailers.com/servmain.html

[spharis]

I picked up a entire disc conversion shipped from Dorsey (best pricing I could find) for under $500.....I bought another wheel, so my actual total was $540.....everyone local was over $650 for the drums, and $700 for disc conversion. When you do a disc conversion, you will need to purchase a new master cylinder/surge actuator assly. Also, I am guessing you have a single axle trailer, so if your local stores are like mine, you are going to have a hard time finding the proper weight on the drums. Most were for lighter trailers, 3250 or so.....the single Dorsey's need to be rated for 3750 pound axle. After comparing prices online at several retailers (e-trailer, dhmtrailers, etc) I went to Dorsey's site, found a catalogue and called and talked to Jeff. Shipped on Friday, got them Tuesday.

[Tip]

Thanks for the info. I will give Dorsey a call. Did you do the conversion yourself, if so how difficult was it to do? I'm curious as to how to bleed the brakes. In a car you push the brake peddle to extract the air, how do you apply pressure to bleed the brakes with a surge actuator?

[Tip]

Thanks for posting the link. I'm pretty sure one of the brakes is too tight.

[spharis]

Im doing it this weekend and tomorrow night. It won't be hard at all. Old hubs and backing plates come off, pack some bearings, put the caliper, hubs, bend the brakeline into place, and swap the actuator. hardest part is going to be getting the beer.

As far as bleeding, there is a tab on the actuator you can pry with a screwdriver to compress the master cylinder to bleed the brakes. it is a 2 person or a pan and walk back and forth job. Look up A-60 google and you will find a manual, but you dont really need one, as they are quite simple. You can also get info by going to UFP's website...universal functional products.

Heres the link to the A60
http://www.ufpnet.com/PDF/Actuators.PDF

and the pdf with the bleeding procedure
http://www.ufpnet.com/PDF/A60-70Maint.PDF

I'll take some pics when I do mine......I'll take some pics of the rust killer I'll be using, and the gelcoat restore polishing I hope to get to as well....

[spharis]

Some articles from champion.....they are not far from my house.

http://www.championtrailers.com/DISC...ON_ARTICLE.HTM

http://www.championtrailers.com/Drum...BrakeArtcl.htm

http://www.championtrailers.com/REVE...OID_VALVES.HTM

Note the tie down kit has a caliper bracket that mounts to all four backing plate holes. My UFP kit (I got from Trailers by Dorsey) has the mount forged as part of the caliper.

[Tip]

Thanks for the links. I talked to folks at Dorsey today and ordered the Disc Kit. Fortunately, I do not have to replace the actuator/master cylinder so it should be fairly straight forward. My kit will not be here until next Tuesday or Wednesday so it looks like I won't be doing the conversion until the following weekend.

Pictures would be great and please let me know if you run into any unforseen difficulties.

Thanks.

[spharis]

Did they say that your current actuator was OK for disc. I was under the impression the disc and drum actuators were two different types. I had to replace mine either way.

BTW I didnt take any pics tonight.......but I did get almost all of the disc conversion done before it started to storm. I have one more fitting to get loose (mine a rusted pretty bad)and then tomorrow, I think I am going to need to go grab a brakline kit and reroute everything.....I need new couplers for sure.

The process is pretty simple...

Break the lugs loose.....and get your bearing buddy off....(Dorsey sends new ones)

Jack up the trailer side.

Remove the wheel.....I always spray mine down with rust killer at this time....your trailer probably isnt as old as mine..(10 years)

Remove the cotter pin, and the nut cap.....save the cap

Remove the hub nut, save the nut

Grab the drum hum and pull it off.....bearings and old seal will all come off.....get the washer that is on top of the outer bearing.....save it

Undo the 4 bolts and nuts that hold the backing plate on.

Undo the drum fitting (brake coupler)

Take the backing plate off

Clean up the spindle and check for burrs or spots, if you find any places, you need to go to Auto Zone and get some emery paper and smooth them out.

Pack your new bearings

Put the rear bearing in, followed by the seal. You need a piece of wood to tap the seal in.....hit it square as it is flimsy and will bend.

Put the hub on the spindle, followed by the outer bearing, washer and nut....I preload with grease at this time too,.....just squrt it into the hub

Tighten the nut until the hub starts to get hard to turn....I figure its about 40 ft lbs ot so....this loads the bearings

Back the nut off......rotate the hub the direction the nut turns.....finger tighten until it starts to slow the wheel down.....tighten a little more, and put the cap and new cotter pin on.....

Take your board, and beat your bearing buddy in......fill with grease.....

Mount the caliper using the supplied bolts....the calipers are threaded....nice huh! You will have to get one side going and then rotate it into place as the pads are new (I dont know if you've ever changed brakes ot not, you will know what I am talking about)

Bend the brake line into the new coupler fitting.....

repeat on the other side, then follow the bleeding procedure above.......I think I will have about 4-5 hours total once I am done. That includes 1 hour for the actuator swap.

Good luck with yours..........

[spharis]

Well 6 hours turned into about 8......I had to replace all my brake line.......so a few trips to the Auto parts store, and alot of tube flaring later....I am done.....

Only bad part is I have a leak..........its small, so it'll do for now, but I have to still work on it more.....I hate that.

[Tip]

Thanks for the details. The actuator I have (A60) will work fine for 10" discs as long as I only put brakes on one axle. If I go with both axles then I would have to upgrade the actuator (according to the guy at Dorsey).

Even though my trailer is only 3 years old I suspect I will have the same trouble with my brake lines, which stinks. Do you know if Dorsey sells the brake lines pre-bent?

[spharis]

I don't know, but it is easier to just run them on the inside of the trailer frame. I redid everything except my tee, and then I had to add a small piece of tubing to my right side to the caliper. The left side was plenty long enough to rebend and add a new fitting on. I am going to pick up a brake line kit from a local store today. They only run about $45-50 and have tees, couplers and everything. I would just pick one of those up. I should have done that to begin with and probably would have saved myself some cash and some time. And just to forewarn you; I don't know if you have ever worked with brakline before, but you are going to have a hard time getting the fittings loose from the drums and any other joints. They are made of brass or aluminum, so they compress fluid tight when tightened, so they round off. it is almost easier to just use your tubing cutter to cut them off and add a new fitting and flare it, or add in a new section, or just re reun everything. In the end I would say just hack all of the old crap off, and re-run it all.....you will save time in the long run.


One more note, did you pick up a reverse solenoid? If you did, you will need to swap your 4 pin flat over to a 6 pin round and tie one of the plugs into your reverse lights, otherwise you will be applying the brakes while backing up. You can pick up just the trailer end plug for < $10 at Wal-Mart. You can get both (if your tow rig doesnt have a round) for <$20. There are 6 prongs on a 6 pin. They are al labeled. RT, LT, GD, TM (markers), A, and E?. Usually E (or whatever is the middle) is reserved for electric brakes and is in the center of the pin, A is for an optional/accessory....so tap your reverse to the A on the tow rig, and hook it up on the other end.

wire colors:
Green (right turn) RT
Yellow (left turn) LT
Green stripe/ brown (markers) TM
Yellow stripe/brown (markers) TM
White (ground) GD

and on the 5 pin
red (accessory) A

and 6 pin
blue (sometimes other color; e-brakes) E

If you didnt get the reverse solenoid, you will need to jam something in the surge to keep it from compressing when you backup. There is a tool, but you can probably just use a socket/pin/??? or something, or you may have the tool. I didnt have anything, so I have the solenoid/actuator on mine.

Hope that helps you.....I check this board ~ 3 or 4 times a day, so post any questions when you start to undertake, and I will see if I have any advice.

[Tip]

The Disc conversion kit I ordered is supposed to have the electric solenoid to lock out the brakes in reverse, I'm not sure if it includes the 6 pin connector though.

Good advice on the brake line kit, I'll get one today. There is nothing more frustrating than starting a project and then mid-way through not having everything needed to complete the job.

[spharis]

I'm sure its the same one I got....if so then it will come with a 5 pin flat harness (the whole 20 someodd feet worth of it) which no one uses on much of anything. Just stop in walmart and pickup a trailer end 6 pin, cut off the 4 pin and rewire it to the 6pin round with the actuator on the acc. pin.

On another note, I went to the local trailer supply ($$$$) and picked up a 20ft. segment of stainless trailer line. $77 ouch!.....should have ordered it from Dorsey, but I didn't think about it at the time. Ah well.....lesson learned.

[Tip]

I have not received my kit yet so I went ahead and tried to loosen the brakeline fittings. The one connected to the starboard side loosened right up. The one on the port side drum is another story, but I was able to loosen it at the T fitting so worse case is I'll just replace the port side line.

I also spoke to Jeff at Dorsey today, he told me the A60 actuator will work fine for a single axle disc brake configuration. I got concerned after looking at Dorsey's website again and saw that they sell an A60 DRUM and an A60 DISC. Jeff told me the only difference is that the A60 DISC comes with the lock out solenoid. So I should be good to go as soon as the kit arrives.