E85 Ethanol?

[Ruune]

I've got another technical question (well, a couple of them, actually)- specifically directed towards Tigé:

I've got a 2004 22v with a Merc. MAG MPI in it. Is this powerplant capable of running on E85 ethanol? If not, are the new vortec or PCM powerplants able to?

The reason I ask is that I burn FAR more fuel in my boat in the summer- more than all of my other vehicles combined. That said, I'd like to know what the manufacturers like Tigé are doing to step up and help clean up the environment!

For those of you that dont know, e85 is a mixture of 85% Ethanol and 15% petrolum. The Ethanol comes from corn and is clean-burning (this also means less "toxic fumes" when you're wakesurfing!). Additionally, it burns more efficiently (105 octane), and is generally cheaper than petroleum-based fuel.

so... thoughts? answers?

[Matt Garcia]

Ruune,

There was discussion about this a while back, read this thread for more. (5th or 6th post down)

[bneub]

Ruune,

I posted some of the info in the other thread and I agree with you. I think E85 capable vehicles, recreational vehicles, boats, etc. are going to be totally demand driven. The more consumers that ask for the product the more the manufacturers will listen. It wouldn't hurt to send an email to marine power and voice your request.

I do realistically think we are a copule of years away from E85 in boats though.

[dogbert]

Re: E85 Ethanol?

Originally posted by Ruune
For those of you that dont know, e85 is a mixture of 85% Ethanol and 15% petrolum. The Ethanol comes from corn and is clean-burning (this also means less "toxic fumes" when you're wakesurfing!). Additionally, it burns more efficiently (105 octane), and is generally cheaper than petroleum-based fuel.

so... thoughts? answers?

If you're worried about fumes, get a Fresh Air Exhaust.

[Ruune]

I know there was a bit of discussion, and I'm trying to get it started up again.

As far as the "fresh air exhaust," that doesnt really do anything but push the fumes into the propwash.

[bneub]

Ruune,

Did Texas really just ban MTBE as an oxygenate? We could have our second ethanol plant within 90 miles of our town within the next year. I think it is great! I am from an agricultural town and grew up on a farm raising mostly corn. Ehtanol is an excellent way to reduce our dependence on foreign oil and reduce emissions at the same time.

Have you checked out ethanol.org? There is a lot of good information there.

What is your personal motivation for ethanol use?

[TeamAllen]

There is an article in Waterski Mag, March 2006 issue, pages 24-25, that is titled, "3 (Crazy) Ideas That Just Might Work." Two of them apply to this subject.

Go Hybrid- High-end Dutch boatbuilder Boesch (boesch-boats.com) recently developed an electric inboard.

Do As The English Do- Nearly all water-ski boats in the United Kingdom run on liquified petroleum gas, or propane. LPG costs about a third of petrol and has fewer harmful emmisions. Hybrid Fuel Systems currently offer conversions on larger boat engines. More info at hybridfuelsystems.com

Boesch Boats
Hybrid Fuel Systems

[gman]

I'm all for a better environment, however consider the following: there are about 76000 btu's in a gallon of ethanol. There are about 125000 btu's in a gallon of gasoline.

[bneub]

Ethaonl does have a lower BTU value than gasoline, but a higher octane rating. Pure ethanol has an octane rating of 113. Ethanol actually burns at a lower temp than gas so the engine will run a little cooler.

I just read that for the 2007 season the IRL IndyCar Series will run a 100 percent fuel grade ethanol.

[CP3]

What changes have to be made to run E85 in a production car.

[bneub]

CP3

Here is a link about E85 conversions. There are a lot of changes that would have to be made to a "regular" car to convert it to E85. Computer program changes, fuel injectors, fuel pump, etc. In a "flexible fuel" vehicle that is designed for E85 and regular unleaded all of these things are designed to work with both fuels.

http://www.e85fuel.com/e85101/faqs/conversion.php

From what I understand it doesn't cost very much to order a new vehicle as a "flexible fuel" vehicle.

[CP3]

Is it too late to start investing in E-85, now after chevy's national commercials.

[bneub]

Ethanol plants are an extremly hot investment around our area right now. All of the ones that I have seen are private placements with high minimum investments (250,000 to 300,000).

[gman]

with lower btu more is needed to do the same amount of work.

[bneub]

gman is right. The fuel to air mixture changes with ethanol. You burn less air and more fuel with ethanol. Economy does go down somewhat. I am hearing 1 - 3 mpg for vehicles.

The same is true for nitromethane that the top fuel dragsters burn. It has about half of the BTU's per gallon as ethanol, or about 1/3 the BTU's of gasoline.

For ethanol, you up the compression ratio of the engine, burn less air and more fuel, and get more power. In the end though you release less total pollutants into the environment and you aren't buying it from the middle east.