Electrical Issue (no Start)

[Thegerman618]

Hey guys,


This is long winded sorry....

I have what I think is unique situation that I have been meaning to figure out that has now led me to no start situation.

When I bought my 06 24Ve' in 2014 the previous owner had 3 batteries installed (2 Interstate Marine "cranking" batteries installed 10/12, and 1 generic auto battery which I have replaced this season to a heavy duty marine battery) The Interstates are on factory Perko On/Off switches on the starboard side, the new battery is on the port side. Everything is connected to a triple bank smart on-board trickle charger. Which I leave plugged full time.

Here is where things get interesting:
if I have the (2) battery switches OFF, the key doesn't work, no stereo etc. as expected. BUT....all my dash switches have power, blower, bilge, etc. even with the Battery switches OFF. Which leads me to believe that dash is powered by the 3rd battery on the port side that is not on any kind of switch. This 3rd battery is NOT as far as I can tell connected to the motor in any way. It only has few wires going to it, (Ballast, on-board charger and a few others. Obviously when I turn the batteries on, everything works....normally.

Back in Dec-Jan I did the Go Surf Assist install which required me to pull all the batteries out to seal thru-hulls. Upon re-connection and lake test it was very very very sluggish on start, but did in fact start, I noticed on start the volt meter was 0 for about 3 seconds then jumped up to 14V. I figured I was loosing the batteries being that they are 5 years old and probably due for change, after about an hour of driving around at surf speed and a few runs up to 30mph we headed for the dock to pick people up. I shut the boat down thinking the batteries would have at least gotten enough charge to fire the boat back up. While again it did start it was very sluggish, thinking for sure now I lost the cranking battery we went out for the rest of the day making sure to not shut the boat off and no issues still reading 13-14 V on the gauge so I think its safe to say my alternator is working properly.

3 weeks ago I disconnect the charger and put a volt meter on the batteries, 12.5, 12.7, 12.7 with no load on the batteries. Assuming the batteries were good to go, headed to the lake. Luckily I didn't disconnect from the trailer as I always fire on the trailer when its floating before I disconnect from the trailer. CLICK CLICK CLICK and very weak from the starter. SH!T....Grabbed my jumper cables and connected to the second battery, CLICK CLICK CLICK but much stronger faster click. I double checked all my connections, made sure I connected everything it all looks correct.

I brought the batteries home to take to the local autozone to see if they can put a load on the batteries and make sure they are good. But I have sneaky feeling the batteries are fine. Other than the starter/alternator what am I missing?

[cbath]

Sounds to me like you have some low state of health batteries that aren't able to maintain a charge.


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[Thegerman618]

thanks for the reply Cbath, I sure hope its only a battery issue.

[JTs-rz2]

Maybe a dead cell in a battery? If batteries are 4 years old - toast IMO. But I am not got at taking care of batteries. I just tell my wife it is time for a new boat.

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[chpthril]

That gen tige was a weird setup. The main cranking is interrupted by the on/off switch, but the rest of the boat still draws off the 2nd battery as those leads are wired battery direct. So the boat for sure will not start with a dead main cranking, all though the helm powers up with a good house battery. However, I have experienced a no start on a boat with a dead house battery.

The most telling would be to check the battery voltage after the batteries have been off the charger for at least 24 hours. This way, you are not reading a surface charge from a recent charging, but rather the battery's actual static level.

That 3rd battery is the dark horse here. In reality, it should be wired in parallel to the original "house" battery. Used any other way, complicates things.

Barring a bad battery, you could have a failing starter or main battery cable thats gone bad.

[Thegerman618]

JTs- I ran that option by the better half and she didn't go for it

So I went out earlier and two main batteries I brought home have been off the charger and sitting in the garage untouched for 2 weeks. Both are Reading 12.5V

So please correct me if I am wrong:

There should be 2 Main Leads coming off the motor, one ground and one positive. That goes direct the cranking battery ONLY
The Stereo and everything else should be ran to the second house battery.
I would like to eliminate the 3rd battery all together cause I could easily put 100lbs of lead back there for additional ballast.

[chpthril]

So I went out earlier and two main batteries I brought home have been off the charger and sitting in the garage untouched for 2 weeks. Both are Reading 12.5V

Those are two perfectly good batteries.

There should be 2 Main Leads coming off the motor, one ground and one positive. That goes direct the cranking battery ONLY

Yes, but the main B+ on the starter, goes through the on/off switch before terminating at the cranking battery.

A battery can weigh 50# and multitask. Lead bags only do one thing If the 3rd battery is deemed a 5th wheel, then yes, do away with it. But, done right, it can be ballast and provide some extended play time with engine off.

[boatwakes]

Brad, if you haven't changed the batteries yet, do that, they're done. Even though they show enough voltage on the posts, they're incapable of producing enough current to start the engine. Put a voltmeter on them WHILE trying to start, you'll see they fall to 6volts or below and that won't get the job done. I just rewired the Hallett last weekend and was jaw droppingly shocked at what I came across and surprised the boat hadn't burned to the waterline yet. Its super easy to wire in a 3rd battery but your onboard charging system should be amended using a pro mariner digital iso-charge unit. Its a digital battery isolator that will charge all the batteries without changing the perko switch position but it keeps them isolated and won't cross drain as a result. We've rewired several boats recently using them and they're awesome.

[Thegerman618]

Thanks for all the help guys, I am taking the batteries over to autozone today to be load tested since the boat is 3 hours away. If they are dropping significantly as Cory said I guess I will be going with a new set of batteries. The more I think about it I wonder if I didn't accidently get the batteries mixed up when I re-installed them and put the stereo battery on the cranking side which if I did would make sense why that battery would be more prone to failure since I have run that thing dry a few times on the beach listening to music.

The boat has a isolated battery charger (unsure of the brand it was in there when I bought it) but it has 3 sets pos/neg wires all with inline fuses going to each battery and charges them without the battery switches on. I have never had a problem though I was sitting in garage cleaning the boat listening to the stereo with the charger on and DP Powell told me that was no good for the batteries? I hadn't heard that before I figured it would just mimic the boat being running while the stereo was on. Is it no good to do that?

How is the hallet running Cory? We should do a Havasu run this season do some bar hopping!

[Germaine Marine]

Buy a new boat, I know a guy.

[Thegerman618]

Buy a new boat, I know a guy.

Looking at a bayliner or a Tahoe!

[Germaine Marine]

No prob. Good luck with the purchase!

[chpthril]

Looking at a bayliner or a Tahoe!

Kool, I heard their 2016 national event drew 20 people

[Thegerman618]

hahha you guys crack me up

[Thegerman618]

Okay finally got back from autozone and they got their battery testing machine fixed, and low and behold BOTH batteries are toast. After 2 weeks of sitting off the charger in my garage here were the results of the test:

Battery 1 (Cranking Battery) 8.9V at rest, dropped to 2V under load.
Battery 2 (Everything else) 11.1V at rest, dropped to 7.4V under load.

While it sucks that I need to fork out a couple of hundred for new batteries, ill take it since I was more concerned it was something more serious like a starter or alternator.