Dual Voice Coil Sub experts . . .

[MRMoffat1]

Finally got my boat back after 5 months in shop.

I'm now going thru all the fixes,updates etc. to verify.

First one I found I'm not sure of - it appears the stereo guy at the service dept wired my Kicker CVR 12" 2 ohm Dual Voice Coil Sub to only one of the coils. Picture and manual attached. The manual clearly states both coils need to be connected to a source of amplification. For a 4 ohm load, assume Sub needs to be hooked up in a series configuration? I will track down the wiring back to my Kicker 650.4 amp, but should be wired to amp2 in bridge mode. Looking for comments from the experts.

[philwsailz]

Finally got my boat back after 5 months in shop.

I'm now going thru all the fixes,updates etc. to verify.

First one I found I'm not sure of - it appears the stereo guy at the service dept wired my Kicker CVR 12" 2 ohm Dual Voice Coil Sub to only one of the coils. Picture and manual attached. The manual clearly states both coils need to be connected to a source of amplification. For a 4 ohm load, assume Sub needs to be hooked up in a series configuration? I will track down the wiring back to my Kicker 650.4 amp, but should be wired to amp2 in bridge mode. Looking for comments from the experts.

If you have the dual 2-ohm woofer with only one coil connected, you are showing a 1-ohm impedance to each of the bridged amp channels; a bad thing.

I strongly recommend that you just run another speaker wire between the amp and the second woofer coil, and wire one coil to EACH amp channel. That way each channel has a nice proper 2-ohm load. Bridging of amplifiers became "faddish" many years ago, and it is just not necessary with today's dual-coil subs. One coil per amp channel will give you the best performance.

[spharis]

Need some more info on the amp sub setup as the amp doesn't really match up to that sub. What are your amps, and speaker config?

One more note; make sure the amp is recieving a mono signal or is set to mono. If the source unit does not have a mono signal going to each channel, then the coils will recieve different signals. Since you have a 4 channel amp, you cannot bridge that amp in a suggested way per channel. You would have one open set of channels if you bridged correctly. It only supports 4ohm bridged on each set of channels.

I would sell or use that amp somewhere else and purchase one specific for a single sub configuration; or buy another sub; if that is the only driver on that amp. List your specs please.

Woofer wiring wizard. Use it.
http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/rftec...1&woofer_imp=3

[philwsailz]

Hey!

MRM-

Check your PM

[Moki]

Which way would you guys recommend wiring my TC Sounds Subwoofer 2 or 8? I have an eclispe amp that can handle down to 2 Ohms.

Option #1


Option #2

[philwsailz]

Which way would you guys recommend wiring my TC Sounds Subwoofer 2 or 8? I have an eclispe amp that can handle down to 2 Ohms.

Option #1


Option #2

Is the amp a single-channel sub amp, or a two channel amp?
If it is a two-channel amp is it stable at 2-ohms per channel, or 2-ohms bridged?

We would need the answers to those two questions to be totally sure. What model Eclipse amp?

[philwsailz]

Need some more info on the amp sub setup as the amp doesn't really match up to that sub. What are your amps, and speaker config?

One more note; make sure the amp is recieving a mono signal or is set to mono. If the source unit does not have a mono signal going to each channel, then the coils will recieve different signals. Since you have a 4 channel amp, you cannot bridge that amp in a suggested way per channel. You would have one open set of channels if you bridged correctly. It only supports 4ohm bridged on each set of channels.



Woofer wiring wizard. Use it.
http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/rftec...1&woofer_imp=3

I agree with SP that if the head unit has a mono output for the subwoofer it is the ideal output from the head unit. I will tend to disagree in part about the statement that the coils will be receiving different signals. Let me elaborate; as a person who spent a lot of his life as a live sound and recording engineer I can share with you that for the frequencies we are talking about, i.e. below 120 Hz, a stereo signal is in effect monaural for all but the most esoteric of recordings. Any recording engineer who mixed and mastered a recording where the signals are different below these frequencies is just asking for trouble.

That being said, yes the signals ARE different, but a mixed mono preamp section on a head unit will electrically do the same thing to get a mono signal as sending a stereo signal via two amp channels to two voice coils in a single woofer. Any out-of-phase information will just cancel, one place or the other. All in-phase information will electrically sum at either place, either in the preamp or in the two voice coils.

[Moki]

Philsailz,
It is the XA 5000 and can be setup as a 3/4/5 channel amp. I am going to use 5 channels. It will power my 4 internal boat speakers and the subwoofer.

http://www.eclipse-web.com/amp/xa5000.html

[spharis]

I agree with SP that if the head unit has a mono output for the subwoofer it is the ideal output from the head unit. I will tend to disagree in part about the statement that the coils will be receiving different signals. Let me elaborate; as a person who spent a lot of his life as a live sound and recording engineer I can share with you that for the frequencies we are talking about, i.e. below 120 Hz, a stereo signal is in effect monaural for all but the most esoteric of recordings. Any recording engineer who mixed and mastered a recording where the signals are different below these frequencies is just asking for trouble.

That being said, yes the signals ARE different, but a mixed mono preamp section on a head unit will electrically do the same thing to get a mono signal as sending a stereo signal via two amp channels to two voice coils in a single woofer. Any out-of-phase information will just cancel, one place or the other. All in-phase information will electrically sum at either place, either in the preamp or in the two voice coils.

You must not every listen to much live Jimi, Stevie, or Fleetwood Mac.....Hard to get a mono signal out a couple of Shure SM57s and keep it pure. We talking rap or rock? Rock will rarely have a mixed down clean signal depending on who and how it was recorded....or the good bands anyway.

[philwsailz]

Philsailz,
It is the XA 5000 and can be setup as a 3/4/5 channel amp. I am going to use 5 channels. It will power my 4 internal boat speakers and the subwoofer.

http://www.eclipse-web.com/amp/xa5000.html

A quick look at the specs suggests that it has five channels, each stable to 2-ohms.

So... If I am reading it correctly, you should get 450W into the subwoofer with wiring option #1

Conversely, you would get roughly 150W with option #2.

I would go with option 1, based on what I read and what you have shared.

[Moki]

A quick look at the specs suggests that it has five channels, each stable to 2-ohms.

So... If I am reading it correctly, you should get 450W into the subwoofer with wiring option #1

Conversely, you would get roughly 150W with option #2.

I would go with option 1, based on what I read and what you have shared.

Thanks! That is the option that I was going to go for. The only reason why I would want to do option 2 is if the amplifier was not stable in 2 ohms, correct?

[philwsailz]

You must not every listen to much live Jimi, Stevie, or Fleetwood Mac.....

Please elaborate... Actually, I listen to all of those, and more

Sorry, I tend to write books, so cliff's notes:

* I don't disagree, (to a point) that the signals from a stereo source are different

* For most recordings signals are mono at the lowest of frequencies where the subwoofer will work; this is simply fact

* The mono output of any head unit literally just electrically sums the two channels; any out-of-phase content is not re-aligned to be in phase left with right, else it would be out of phase with one of the full range channels at or near crossover point(s).

* You get the same summing by sending an amplified stereo signal into a dual voice coil woofer

* I already agreed that if a mono sub output is available it is the preferred pre-amp signal

[philwsailz]

Thanks! That is the option that I was going to go for. The only reason why I would want to do option 2 is if the amplifier was not stable in 2 ohms, correct?

Correct.

[NICKYPOO]

Oh boy, Stereo Expert Showdown. Let me go and get my popcorn.

[spharis]

Which way would you guys recommend wiring my TC Sounds Subwoofer 2 or 8? I have an eclispe amp that can handle down to 2 Ohms.

Option #1


Option #2

Use option 1.