Wakesurfing = Negligent Boater Operation???

[dogbert]

Ummm...With all of your weight on your feet?

BTW, remember that if the boat is properly running and has enough air at the intake, it puts out CO2, and only small amounts of CO. The reason the boat puts out CO is when it is not getting enough oxygen (O) to combine with the carbon in the gasoline, so it starts making carbon MONoxide instead of carbon DIoxide. Sucking on the tailpipe of a well ventilated engine will probably not kill you from Carbon Monoxide, but if you put the engine in a closed room, it will use up all of the oxygen until it starts to put out CO instead of CO2.

I was actually asking seriously because, as you've probably seen, my kids ride the surf board all kinda ways. I was actually wondering if that was stipulated in any laws...the fact that you had to be upright.

Anyway, the bigger danger for CO poisoning is not the rider, but those folks sitting on the sun deck with their feet on the swim platform while you're riding. If you read Larry Mann's Coast Guard study, it clearly identifies the fact that the station wagon effect poses the greatest danger, especially to the occupants sitting close to the transom.

So, if you're operating your boat in a safe manner and everyone's seated in the boat on a V-Drive, you're probably ok. A direct drive might be an issue for those occupants sitting in the back seat.

[LovinPowell]

Here is the law in Idaho (see last paragraph):
IDAPA 26
TITLE 01
CHAPTER 30
26.01.30 - IDAHO SAFE BOATING RULES
525. NEGLIGENT OPERATION.
Negligent operation, as used in Section 67-7017, Idaho Code, shall include, but not be limited to, the following:
(1-1-94)
01. Airborne. Becoming airborne or completely leaving the water while crossing the wake of another
vessel at an unsafe distance from the vessel creating the wake; or (3-23-98)
02. Weaving. Weaving through congested traffic; or (3-23-98)
03. Speed or Proximity. Operating at such a speed and proximity to another vessel, a person, or property
of other persons so as to require the operator to swerve at the last moment to avoid collision; or. (3-23-98)
04. Unsafe Seating While Underway. Operating a motorboat while a person sits, stands, or kneels on
the bow deck, gunwales, transom, or any other areas not designed by the manufacturer for passengers, while the vessel
is underway at a speed greater than no wake or five (5) miles per hour, except when immediately necessary for safe and
reasonable navigation or operation; or ( )
05. Unsafe Operation – Person In Vicinity of Vessel. Operating a motorboat, or engaging the engine of
an idle motorboat, when someone is occupying the water in a manner or in proximity to the vessels propulsion and or
exhaust so as to create a safety hazard. Examples of unlawful activity would include the practice of teak surfing or
wake surfing. ( )

Ouch, that is kind of harsh to include wakesurfing in the same sentence as teak surfing. My guess would be that some uneducated lawmaker has used the term without fully understanding the meaning. Nevertheless it is still there in print. Looks like some clarification and amendments are in order.

[dogbert]

Here is the law in Idaho (see last paragraph):
IDAPA 26
TITLE 01
CHAPTER 30
26.01.30 - IDAHO SAFE BOATING RULES
525. NEGLIGENT OPERATION.
...
05. Unsafe Operation – Person In Vicinity of Vessel. Operating a motorboat, or engaging the engine of
an idle motorboat, when someone is occupying the water in a manner or in proximity to the vessels propulsion and or
exhaust so as to create a safety hazard. Examples of unlawful activity would include the practice of teak surfing or
wake surfing. ( )

[LovinPowell]

I was actually asking seriously because, as you've probably seen, my kids ride the surf board all kinda ways. I was actually wondering if that was stipulated in any laws...the fact that you had to be upright.

Anyway, the bigger danger for CO poisoning is not the rider, but those folks sitting on the sun deck with their feet on the swim platform while you're riding. If you read Larry Mann's Coast Guard study, it clearly identifies the fact that the station wagon effect poses the greatest danger, especially to the occupants sitting close to the transom.

So, if you're operating your boat in a safe manner and everyone's seated in the boat on a V-Drive, you're probably ok. A direct drive might be an issue for those occupants sitting in the back seat.

Utah law states that it is illegal to be within something like 20 feet of the boat in a "non-standing" position. I submitted two pictures of wakesurfer's to the State one on one knee and the other on two knees and asked if either would be considered legal. Never got a response.

[formandfunction]

All the stupid stuff people do and they outlaw wakesurfing.This country is coming to a end one law at a time.

[formandfunction]

This thread makes me angry.What kind of country is this when they outlaw a family activity like wakesurfing?

[LovinPowell]

Education is the key to keeping wakesurfing legal and it will take a concerted effort on the part of everyone to get the educated word out there. You might want to consider contacting your senators and representatives now and be proactive instead of being reactive. It is much easier to keep wakesurfing legal from the start than it is to try and reverse something already on the books.

Idaho, it looks like you are "on the clock" to take some action.

[chpthril]

I swear I saw a thread on WW, or maybe here, awhile back about Idaho outlawing wakesurfing.

Ignorance is usually at the root of such laws

[malarson]

OK, Here's what I've done so far. I've called the local Prosecutors office. Of course the lady on the phone had no idea what wakesurfing was and promised to have the prosecutor call me back (good luck).
I've contacted the local TV station and pitched the story to them. We'll see if they pick it up.
You'll notice that this statute was on the books in 1994 but I can't find it on any current documents. Perhaps it was repealed but It'll take some research.
I've also found the contact info for the Idaho Boating Law Administrator. His name is Dave Dahms. I'll see if I can contact him by phone or send him a nicely worded e-mail.
I'll keep you posted and any other advice is welcome.
Mike

[Bandsecurity]

OK, Here's what I've done so far. I've called the local Prosecutors office. Of course the lady on the phone had no idea what wakesurfing was and promised to have the prosecutor call me back (good luck).
I've contacted the local TV station and pitched the story to them. We'll see if they pick it up.
You'll notice that this statute was on the books in 1994 but I can't find it on any current documents. Perhaps it was repealed but It'll take some research.
I've also found the contact info for the Idaho Boating Law Administrator. His name is Dave Dahms. I'll see if I can contact him by phone or send him a nicely worded e-mail.
I'll keep you posted and any other advice is welcome.
Mike

The 1994 date was when the original law was enacted. The last section, section 5 dealing with wake surfing was added in 2005 or 6. You can google it and come up with the history of the law. From my recollection, there was not a hearing or the proposed law was not challenged, so there could be an opportunity to change it in the future. However, that will be very difficult as I assume it was passed by the state legislature. The way to attack it is to find out the reason behind it being passed which is usually a death or tradegy. You would then point out changes in safety - FAS or inboard v. v-drive which would mitigate against further occurences.
The best way to get the law changed is to have the boat dealers rally against it. They already likely have a lobbying arm and have more power than a couple of boat owners. If the boat dealers potentially will lose sales, you will see some change.

[Bandsecurity]

http://www.legislature.idaho.gov/ses...2601300701.pdf

[chadster2]

I've seen a news report on here that might help
Don't remember where.
I used to think it ment holding onto the teak....

[SPBFAN]

I guess more people need to get to know there law makers. We are doing it to our selves. Like someone said one law at a time. We are slowly giving up our freedoms.

Maybe we need to start to spend more time writing letter so demand to the law makers threating them with there jobs and have some petitions behind what we do. They might start to make laws that are worth something. What surprised me about this is that California was not first to the table with it. Of course our law makers are probably surfing also.

[malarson]

Just got off the phone with the County prosecutor. Very nice conversation. She said that years ago the Sheriff had received a training video of an up and coming sport of Wakesufing. They had watched the video with the former prosecutor and determined that it was unsafe and would not be allowed.
We discussed the difference between an inboard and an I/O boat and the difference between teak surfing & wakesurfing. She also let me know that she grew up on the water but wasn't familiar with the sport.
After a few minutes I offered to do an on the water demonstration with her and the Sheriff and she seemed really excited to see what all the fuss was about. She said she'll set up the meeting in the next few days.
I'm really excited to show the local officials how safe & fun it can be. I'll let everyone know how it turns out.
Education seems to be the key.
Mike

[chadster2]

He threatened me with a $300 ticket.
threatened
That's better "threatened"
I didn't see the good part "threatened"

We need to rename what we are doing so they would have to be
educated to even write the law against it.
let's call it..... ...... .... rope less boarding... or ...... or.... safety mono skiing.....
or..... old timers equalizer..... or..... ... HOLD EVERYTHING......
let's talk to the board manufactures let them earn their $$