Trucks- The good bad and the ugly.

[spooner]

I missed the last few posts on this thread awhile ago and have to stoke the Pilot vs truck fire a little. I towed for 2 years with a pilot then bought a 04 f150 pilot towed better and got better fuel mileage. Honda over engineers everything kinda like tige . That pilot will tow way better and safer than a "old beater" with drum brakes ,no active traction controll, no air bags etc.
As for ins companys denieing the claim hell its a insurance co. they can allways find a reason can't they?

[raythompson]

A buddy of mine is DOT guy and he would park you on side of the road. Other bigger thing is if you get in an accident (even not your fault) you are gonna be uninsuranced as soon as the insurance company finds out the boat was over the legal limit. I know trucks are not cheap (recently bought a Titan) but come on man, you have a $50k boat, buy a full size beater truck in the meantime, it is not safe. My 2 cents anyhow.

Towing limits on vehicles are not legal limits. They are only the recommendations from the manufacturer and exceeding such limits may void warranties and damage the vehicle. Would an insurance company deny you a claim because your tires were over the recommended inflation level? (Well, if they could they would certainly try, bastards.) I have seen some really scary towing situations that the police basically ignored. I don't know how the police would feel if the vehicle was involved in an accident.

Anyway, I think the most important consideration is to get a vehicle with a frame. I don't know if the Pilot has a frame. The body does not become involved in the towing load and instead the stress is placed on the frame mounted components, engine, transmission, axle, and hitch.

I could make the argument that my F-150 is not much heavier than my boat if at all. However the tow rating does exceed my boat weight. This is due to the towing package with heavier components, additional cooling, additional braking, higher ratio rear end, larger truck tires, and frame mounted hitch components.

[Ruune]

I missed the last few posts on this thread awhile ago and have to stoke the Pilot vs truck fire a little. I towed for 2 years with a pilot then bought a 04 f150 pilot towed better and got better fuel mileage. Honda over engineers everything kinda like tige . That pilot will tow way better and safer than a "old beater" with drum brakes ,no active traction controll, no air bags etc.
As for ins companys denieing the claim hell its a insurance co. they can allways find a reason can't they?

I'm going to have to pull the BS card on this. Its simple physics: the honda pilot is not long enough, nor is it heavy enough to control the load of a boat like that. Its not about pulling power- its about stopping power. Also, an older "beater" truck is going to have a better braking (i.e. TOWING) capacity than a smaller vehicle. Period. Tow rating has as much to do with the ability of a vehicle to control the inertial force of the trailer during emergency deceleration.

In other words, try hooking up a heavy boat like this to a pilot, accelerate to highway speed, then slam on the brakes and swerve as if you're avoiding an obsticle.

My money is on the following result: Since the short (and narrow) wheelbase dont provide enough leverage, coupled with the fact that the boat & trailer far outweighs the tow vehicle, the trailer will keep going in a straight line. Since the tow vehicle is unable to control the inertia, it simply gets dragged along for the ride. This is called jack knifing. Newton's first law of physics (aka "the law of inertia") states that an object in motion tends to remain at motion. Again, simple physics.

Now imagine that there's a minivan full of kids that you were trying to swerve around. You just killed the three that were in the back seat.

Bottom line: You need to pull a full-sized boat with a full-sized truck.

[Ruune]

In regards to the features that a pilot has that you claim is justification for ignoring the tow rating specified by the manufacturer's engineers:

Drum vs. Disc Brakes: For what its worth, my brand new 2007 GMC Sierra has drum brakes on the rear, with discs up front. So did my 1993 Dodge. Still think your pilot can stop a trailer better? Think again.

Traction control- Although this may help, your not going to get better traction than you would by simply having more weight over the wheels.

Air bags- What the heck does this have to do with a vehicle's ability to tow and STOP a rig? Brilliant.

Furthermore, as Raythompson indicated, proper towing packages include aux trans coolers, lower gear ratios, frame mounted hitches, etc. The pilot doesnt even have a frame- it has a unibody.

Before you go off and say "Well you really should try driving one." I have. In fact, one of my closest friends has owned one since 2003. I agree that they're built well, but it is by no means a tow vehicle.

[Matt Garcia]

Ray, can you check your Tigeowners.com account e-mail again please? I still have your old email address on file.

Sorry for the hijack.

Thanks
Matt

[Ruune]

its ok- your penance can be to unlock the "accessory" thread.
</hijack>

[spooner]

Wow, I did not know I would need a fire suit.
First, I no longer own a pilot.

When I bought my boat All I had was a pilot and a accord so the pilot got to tow IMO not Ideal but I thought it did a good job. I then traded my accord for a 04 F-150 which seemed to tow just as well if not worse and the mileage got a lot worse.My comparson is based on towing the same boat to the same places with these two different vehicles.

Ruune, I did not mean to upset you.

My comments about ACTIVE traction controll, and airbags go to the overall saftey of the vehicle. I disagree that drum brakes stop better than disc when towing disc brakes are much more effective and rarely over heat they also allow 4 channel abs where drum do not .

So are you really saying that it is safer to have a 1990 pick up than that pilot? I tried that too. My f-150 was leased and went back last year, thinking I would save some green to perhaps get a new boat I bought a 90 F-250 with a 5.8 to do the job fact is it wouldn't it took longer to stop and way longer to accellerate. I used the pilot instead it worked much better. I should add I live in a sparcely populated area and rarely drive in traffic. Most towing is done on two lane roads @65mph.

I reread you posts Ruune and I guess I really got you pissed off That was not my intention at all. We will just have to agree to disgree that a 4 wheel disc, 4channel active traction controll will stop better than a 93 ram with drums and rear abs at best.

[Jason B]

its ok- your penance can be to unlock the "accessory" thread.
</hijack>

SOLID!!!!!!!!!

[Ruune]

Wow, I did not know I would need a fire suit.
First, I no longer own a pilot.

When I bought my boat All I had was a pilot and a accord so the pilot got to tow IMO not Ideal but I thought it did a good job. I then traded my accord for a 04 F-150 which seemed to tow just as well if not worse and the mileage got a lot worse.My comparson is based on towing the same boat to the same places with these two different vehicles.

Ruune, I did not mean to upset you.

My comments about ACTIVE traction controll, and airbags go to the overall saftey of the vehicle. I disagree that drum brakes stop better than disc when towing disc brakes are much more effective and rarely over heat they also allow 4 channel abs where drum do not .

So are you really saying that it is safer to have a 1990 pick up than that pilot? I tried that too. My f-150 was leased and went back last year, thinking I would save some green to perhaps get a new boat I bought a 90 F-250 with a 5.8 to do the job fact is it wouldn't it took longer to stop and way longer to accellerate. I used the pilot instead it worked much better. I should add I live in a sparcely populated area and rarely drive in traffic. Most towing is done on two lane roads @65mph.

I reread you posts Ruune and I guess I really got you pissed off That was not my intention at all. We will just have to agree to disgree that a 4 wheel disc, 4channel active traction controll will stop better than a 93 ram with drums and rear abs at best.

Sorry if I came off like I was pissed off- that was not my intent. I've seen some seriously bad accidents (ex. overloaded trailer and rig crashing into a minivan full of kids) due to this sort of thing. Another example happend when riding my motorcycle from a trip in SW Texas, going down I-10, heading into San Antonio. The driver of a Ford Dually was pulling a triple axle cattle trailer, and the trailer apparently didnt have working brakes. Although no people got hurt, the trailer jacknifed and well, lets just say there was a lot of tenderized steak on the road.

[Ruune]

SOLID!!!!!!!!!

Bibbs promises to behave.

[Matt Garcia]

its ok- your penance can be to unlock the "accessory" thread.
</hijack>

Ha haha...you dudes are a riot. Hey by the way I was up in your area (Helotes) during Thanksgiving. We ate El Chappral, damn that was some good mexican food!!

[Ruune]

wow... I used to work there when I was in college (UTSA). My parents live on one of the hills across from there. I hope you didnt have to drive very far afterwards! I always overdo it there and end up paying for it about 15mins later... NOT good on a motorcycle trip!

[Razzman]

Ahhh ... nothing better than good mex food! Never ate it either on bike road trips, especially in the middle of nowhere!

Speaking of which, i just sold my '06 Harley FLHX monday night to a lady outta Folsom, CA for $18,000 all within 24 hours of posting on Craigslist! And everybody said i couldn't sell for what i wanted! BAH! One more to go now ...

On topic: I towed mine for a couple months with the wife's '03 Durango/4.7L V8 and it was squirrly being short wheelbase, not to mention it strained it a bit. I can tow so much better with the '07 GMC Sierra Clubcab 4x4 5.3L and personally i can't see towing with anything more other than to have bragging rights which i'm not into.

[mtnsmith]

Anyone with a Titan out there?? I think I saw anhaney with one...Anyhow, I will hopefully be bringing one home this weekend if it gets here, I'll take some pics as soon as I can. My dealer couldn't find me one anywhere in the southeast as there are not very many 4x4's in Florida so I ended up getting one straight from the factory. Then the wonderful weather last week up north delayed it getting on a truck so they sent it by train to Orlando, hopefully it will be here this week since it was actually supposed to be here last week. Well, enough ranting about my yet to be delivered truck.

[raythompson]

Ray, can you check your Tigeowners.com account e-mail again please?

Done.