Surf diagnostic says overcurrent

[Langwell]

Anybody ever have this please help

[freeheel4life]

Seeing this on a handful of new boats. Answer so far has been new actuators. Tige is asking for them back so haven't got to take one apart. Don't actually think water intrusion is the problem. Believe that when they are rigged they are getting bound up because they don't turn the rod section out a turn and a half and force hardware in to mount it. Regardless, there is mechanical resistance happening in actuators which in turn means more amps to complete the work. Murphy PDM sees amp draw go up and decides to stop sending current, which equals your taps 3 not working.

Only reason I say that it's been rigged incorrectly and is source of MECHANICAL resistance is the last two boats that have had this issue have been a bear to get either pin out at platform or bolt out at plate. Actuators is obviously bound in place which I believe is causing resistance when programming tries to retract plates fully. Just my .02. Do know for a fact that last two 17's I've done the swap on haven't been back, but I turn rod out a turn and a half to make connection to plate line up.

[Langwell]

Thanks , guess this means trip to the dealer. 2nd time since ive had the boat , 3 weeks and 45 hrs total. First was o2 sensor , both cadilitic converters and a starter. Now actuators , im seriously getting beyond over it !!!!!

[Langwell]

And also had little warning signs on several light components as you can see in the picture.

[Bakes5]

Hey...how much ballast you running? Wonder if 5k of ballast/passengers isn't too much. Adding 2-3k of ballast over factory sounds like a good way to stress out components. Nautique learned this with their snapping driveshafts.

IMO, adding ballast is like putting bigger tires on your jeep. Once you put bigger tires on you start a cascade of upgrades like axles, gearing, u joints, driveshafts, and engine swaps do you can fit/run those 44" mudders. Adding the ridiculous ballast people run surely stressed actuators, bogs the engine down, increases hull stresses (*gel cracks?), etc. 18+ have the 2:1 tranny option which helps the drivetrain, but I wonder if they shouldn't be working on beefing up actuators and plates. Does the Z1 or RZR have the same TAPS gear as the RZX3.

Just my opinions and thoughts.

[Langwell]

Have 600lbs lead , 3 on each side . Only had 6 adults on board.

[freeheel4life]

Bakes-
Of the last two z3's that came in one was running stock L bags no lead, not sure of crew size. Other was running 250lbs lead in each rear corner and stock ballast, and know he rolls a small crew.

One things that everyone has apparently forgotten, LISTING. Yes it sucks that your super expensive luxury items aren't working as advertised, but nothing has changed on the z3 hull, and many others since taps 3 rolled out. List it over and do it like you used too. Yes transfer times suck, but it seems a whole lot better than waiting on your dealer. If it was me I certainly wouldn't bother dropping my boat off for a taps 3 issue until I was assured they had Lenco actuators on hand and an open/scheduled spot in service bay.

[Bakes5]

Thanks....this type of thing is not Tige specific. Seems like similar issues with surfgate and NSS. The ballast weights have gone up so much over the past few years that I cannot help but wonder if a slight beefing up, from all manufacturers, isn't in order.

If the same hardware is used on the RZR as compared to the RZX3, it would be intersting to look at actuator failure rates.

[UNSTUCK]

Not sure what ballast has to do with actuator failure. Ballast just sinks the boat, but that doesn't make any more water push against the tab. Increasing your speed is the only thing I can think of that will add stress to the TAPS 3 system.

I do like the idea of the actuators binding up. I remember when I installed my TAPS 21 system it took a while to find the right mounting location for the actuator on the transom that wouldn't cause binding. This was because my TAPS 3 tabs did not rotate perpendicular to the transom. Anyone having issues with their TAPS 3 system should remove the actuator from the tab and then cycle the actuator all the way in and all the way out, one inch at a time, making sure you can still reinstall the pin and each point. Then remove it again, turn the boat off so the actuator auto retracts, then try to reinstall the pin one last time. Pin should go in easy each time.

[tigemech]

Seeing this on a handful of new boats. Answer so far has been new actuators. Tige is asking for them back so haven't got to take one apart. Don't actually think water intrusion is the problem. Believe that when they are rigged they are getting bound up because they don't turn the rod section out a turn and a half and force hardware in to mount it. Regardless, there is mechanical resistance happening in actuators which in turn means more amps to complete the work. Murphy PDM sees amp draw go up and decides to stop sending current, which equals your taps 3 not working.

Only reason I say that it's been rigged incorrectly and is source of MECHANICAL resistance is the last two boats that have had this issue have been a bear to get either pin out at platform or bolt out at plate. Actuators is obviously bound in place which I believe is causing resistance when programming tries to retract plates fully. Just my .02. Do know for a fact that last two 17's I've done the swap on haven't been back, but I turn rod out a turn and a half to make connection to plate line up.

I have seen issues with the actuators getting water in them, it really shouldnt matter on if you turn the rod out or not. They work on a set value based on the length of the actuator. The ones that have been bad, have seem to have had water in them. If you shake the actuator you can hear water splashing around.

[Bakes5]

I don't know....I think increased boat weight puts more stress on the tabs at any given speed. They are kinda lifting devices. If they have 800 extra pounds of lead in back and 3-4 dudes sitting on the transom, that weight gets translated into the tabs and actuators as they lift and then tilt the boat off axis.

Again....if we have the exact same hardware on the RZR as we do an RZX3, that might be the weak link. A nice look at actuator failure in the RZR vs the RZX would be telling.

[Germaine Marine]

The weight has an effect but it isnt why they are failing. Some are getting water in them as simple as that. Stock boats to heavy weighted boats really no correlation. My 16z3 that is now in texas is still running fine without issue and that thing had 1000-1500 in lead in the rear its entire life.

The water gets in them, spikes the resistance and they dont operate. Hopefully Lenco has got it figured out.

[Bakes5]

Probably right on that. I'm no engineer. I just know there are few free lunches in this world and when people are ballasting up their boats until they barely float, components will need to be upgraded. Already happening with 2:1 trannies, 1 1/4 shafts, bigger propellers. I wouldn't be surprised if more heavy duty surf hardware is the next step in the chain. Seems like everyone and their dog is running 4-5k of ballast. Might also just be the simple fact that the system complexity is increasing. Screens, computers, and increasing the number of actuators from 1 to 3 would increase the failure rate easily 3-5 times the failure rate of say a 2009 model with gauges and a single TAPS plate/actuator. Just more failure points and places things can go wrong. It will be interesting to see how many screens are still original in 10-15 years.

[UNSTUCK]

You are definitely right about the increased ballast load causing issues with the boats. I just don't think it's in the surf system. Think of the 2009 model in your example. Imagine that boat fully ballasted from stock, set up for wake boarding. The single actuator on the taps 2 trying to lift the whole back of the boat up to help it get on plane. For a long time those actuators handles those loads just fine, at twice the speed.

Now the boat trying just to move those kinds of loads is really bad. My biggest concern for increasing the HP of my engine is wondering if the rest of the drivetrain can handle the added power. Don't know that, and dont know how to even go about beefing it up if it is needed.

[Thegerman618]

Bakes5 I believe you are onto something. I see 3 major changes for the future of surfing.

Major upgrades to hardware is coming and already here. I hear the prop shafts on the new Tiges are 1.5". I am sure that as we see surfing system failures whether it be from plate or actuator failure we will start to see Lenco or Bennett recommend moving to heavy duty DUAL actuator setups (Like the older TAPS1 system). Or as I have heard we are only seeing these failures are a result of a bad batch of Actuators which is why not only Tige is affected.

I think mastercraft had it right about 10 years ago with a boat but it was a decade to soon. Who Remembers the X80? I honestly see this setup as the future of surf boats. Dual Big Motors 440+, Dual Actuator Surf Systems. You get the weight of Dual motors in the rear and a Huge Center Ballast Bow to Stern and could easily punch the surf boat size into the 26'+ range and the cost of a new one well into and over the quarter million mark. Most of the new boats today are coming in at 7-8000lbs dry and with ballast are over 10K total displacement and there are some of crazy picky surfers that are easily sneaking up on 13-14K lbs total displacement. At some point, as bakes said there needs to be an engineering change either to hardware or design.

Or....to dream of the future a bit. To see an articulating hull, one that can physically change shape or hull panel orientation on the fly. Some lessons from the offshore racing boats and bigger offshore fishing boats that already have similar technology with staged hulls or drag panels that keep boats more stable in hazardous conditions. While I think we are likely decades away from that technology at our level, who knows what the next sport behind the boats will be or what surfing will look like in 10 years.

All in all, its great time to own a boat. Computers on boats and motors are somewhat of PITA, but also are the first thing we all cling to when there is problem. While there is an issue with Langwells boat, at least he knows exactly where to look to solve the problem or was able to identify a problem that with older boat would have never been known or could have left him in a bad situation on the water. These computers all have bugs and gremilins living in them, but that is benefit to software updates. If you buy a 1st Gen boat, guess who just became Tige's Beta Tester?

Hope Langwell gets his boats squared away!