Auto ignition switch ?

[hairball]

Easy question, I have a pcm 343 in my 2009 z1. It died on me last yr after an 8 hr session. Since then I have replaced all filters and fluids and the starter. Still won't crank. My mechanic now says it was my ignition switch. Very strange as it turns over. That's my question now. He says my ignition, when bumped over, keeps turning over the motor automatically and continuously until it cranks. Now I thought that was normal as my Beemer does that too, once you push the start button it turns over until it fires up.

So is this a normal condition or is he right it should only turn over while turning the key? Also he says my starter is out AGAIN? Could it really be possible that my boat quit running bc the switch is bad? I mean the thing died and turns over but won't fire. He does have a $7000 diagnostic machine but that just seems a lil odd but I'm not a cert mech by any means....thanks in advance

[chpthril]

Im a little confused, cause it sure sounds like you now have 2 problems. So the engine was running normal, died and would not restart? Restart as in not run, but would crank over under the power of the starter? A bad starter will not prevent an engine from running, just prevent it from not turning over. The key switch has the STR terminal that only has voltage when the key is in the crank position, which is spring loaded. Release the key and it returns to RUN and the starter stops. RUN has 12v when the key is turned to run, and could be a cause for the engine not running. ACC has 12V when the key is in both ON and the ACC position. The head-unit red trigger is usually the only thing on that circuit. A volt meter and 60 seconds can determine if the switch is an issue.

The Neutral safety switch on the trans may prevent the engine from running, but allow it to crank, but IIRC, it actually interrupts the 12V from the key to the starter. I think the kill switch interrupts the 12V to the key switch. Again, that volt meter will make quick work of those.

When cranking, has anyone checked for spark on 2-3 plug wire ends? Has the fuel pressure been checked? Those 2 things, along with air, is all an engine needs to run.

[ericinmich]

hairball - This comment is only regarding your comment about the engine continuouing to crank after you let go of the key. That is not normal on a boat. To my knowledge, no boat is using ECM/PCM control start, which is very common on almost all cars now.

[hairball]

hairball - This comment is only regarding your comment about the engine continuouing to crank after you let go of the key. That is not normal on a boat. To my knowledge, no boat is using ECM/PCM control start, which is very common on almost all cars now.

Turn key to start and release and it will spin the starter until it cranks until you turn the key back to acc

So I guess this isn't normal and my switch is bad

Now, why won't the boat run? I will suggest some things to the mechanic that chpthril mentioned

Thanks again

[hairball]

So mechanic says it's the starter, he says all the power runs through the starter solenoid and could be causing the continuous turn over and also keeping the boat from running, of course I asked him to check power after the starter and he replied you need one anyway so let's try that first, well ok then.

What's ur thoughts chp? Anyway off topic I'm in NC so how much for some rev 10s when I get my tub running again?

[chpthril]

I'll hit you via PM, but we can certainly get you fixed up. If I wasnt so booked up right now, I tell you to bring the boat in, but if you dont get any where, let me know.

[chpthril]

Ok, if a faulty starter is not spinning the engine fast enough, then yes, the engine may not fire. Without knowing actual voltage at specific points during certain events, its hard to speculate

[hairball]

Well I don't expect anyone to diagnose this thing via forum text, but the thing spins over fine. He is saying that it wont fire bc the power is stopping at the starter and not continuing to the distributer. Really easy to just check for spark at the plug wires I would think, but hell maybe that would be too easy. I have done a lot of wrench turning but following voltage current from battery to plug aint something I've tried. I do have a harbor freight volt meter that's never been turned on haha. I would've thought they would've checked that first or at least their 7k machine could tell them what the deal is?

[chpthril]

He is saying that it wont fire bc the power is stopping at the starter and not continuing to the distributer

Im hoping something is getting lost in translation but this is just not sounding right. The starter is just a DC motor that engages the motor and spins it. It has no control circuit for other things like the ignition or fuel pumps. At the most, there will be a B+ cable sharing the main starter post with the cable that connects to the battery.

[chpthril]

Heres a thought, have your guy check the small wire that connects to the main battery switch. it feeds the ECM and has been not to corrode. Theres 2 main large battery cables and thats the only other wire and its like 12 or 14 ga.

[jrj701]

hairball - This comment is only regarding your comment about the engine continuouing to crank after you let go of the key. That is not normal on a boat. To my knowledge, no boat is using ECM/PCM control start, which is very common on almost all cars now.

It has been normal on both of my Tige's. Both my 07 and now my 2011 will crank until the engine fires even if you let off the key. Your 09 should as well.

[ericinmich]

I am not going to try to debate this over the internet bit I would love to see someone show me an engine wiring schematic that has the starter relay being pulled in by a control signal from the ECM. I bet this isn't true. There are just to many other fail safes (checks) that are used in a car that does it that wouldn't exist in a boat.

[hairball]

It has been normal on both of my Tige's. Both my 07 and now my 2011 will crank until the engine fires even if you let off the key. Your 09 should as well.

That is exactly what mine does turn the key and release and the motor spins until it fires. In my case the motor won't fire so I turn the key back to acc after around 10 sec so the starter doesn't burn up. My mech and others on here say that's not normal. I'm not sure how the boat would malfunction and do this by accident but hell I'm just trying to avoid a $200 starter when I just rebuilt this one, but looks like I'm going to have to just so the mech will move forward. I just don't believe my boat choked and died bc of a bad solenoid connection

[kko]

They do crank after letting off on the key. that's a fact and normal. On the newer ones say 07 and up. I think your mech is lost. It's real hard over the internet to tell what's going on. 2 questions I would want answered. Do you have spark? Easy to check with a $10 spark checker. Do you have fuel pressure. Fuel pressure gauge $75.
With all this if I were a betting man...your low pressure fuel pump took a ****. Pretty common on that year PCM eng. when I was wrenching on Tiges we had a lot of them crap out. Not saying it's what it is but I know this it would be the first thing I checked if I had your boat in for a crank no start. Good luck!

[hairball]

Let me give you word for word, dude says power goes from battery to starter to distributor, sounds funky to me but like I said I'm not cert nor do I have a 7k diag machine. But I will add to this, last 4th of July rains 12 in freakin crazy. Boat is in the water covered and still takes on more unwanted ballast than it takes to push ragboy into an aerial(jk) cuz my bilge pump was pissed. Drained, rode for 8 hrs soon after motor choked quit and now after 2 mech I'm back to starter, will replace 2moro but I feel it's not gonna fix sh** So I'm gonna try and tell mr know it all that chpthril said to check this and that and anything below the starter as far as sensors wires etc. any other ideas are welcome and thanks a lot guys I really do appr all ur help