Bad dewinterization- any thoughts

[kko]

Yuk!
Sorry about the bad news. Did they do a compression check?

[GUY_RPM]

Not yet, just pulled the manifolds and risers off tonight.

[Ruger761]

Man sorry to hear that one. Hopefully it will just be manifold/risers not the heads or even worse the block. Im still kinda shocked that with anit-freeze it had something freeze in it last year.

[GUY_RPM]

Me too. It was not a very cold winter here in Kentucky. All I can figure is maybe it had a fracture in it that did not go to the surface that opened up to the sealing surface. I truly don't know, I am just grasping at straws.

[GUY_RPM]

Alright, I need some help from the Tige motor literate people on here. I just spoke to my mechanic and he took some time to think about my situation and he called another mechanic who also agreed with his new theory. He took the manifolds off as well as the risers and found no signs of cracks. What he now thinks is that the way I started it created the issue. He says it is rare but he believes since I turned on the water myself then walked to the boat, climbed in and started it that the time period from when I turned on the water to when I started the boat( about 45 seconds) forced water onto the cylinders. This theory makes more sense since I am sure I winterized it good but I am not sure how water could get to the top of the cylinders from using the fake a lake? He said most people turn the water on and start the boat at about the same time. So my question for you guys is, has anyone else had this happen and is it possible?

[chpthril]

Well, I hate to debunk the theory, but 99% of the time, im doing boats on fake-a-lakes by my self. So im always turning the water then climbing into the boat to fire up. On some occasions, I will shut the engine off to do something, leaving the water running, then restart to further my tests.

With a sound engine, I do not see this being the cause, sorry.

Was the water in cylinders on one side, the other or both, all on one side or the other, random cylinders, etc? Rust trails? Was a compression test and then cylinder lead-down test done?

[GUY_RPM]

No compression test yet. He said there was water on both sides but it was in the cylinders that were the lowest cylinders, back two on each side.

[wired1236]

Well, I hate to debunk the theory, but 99% of the time, im doing boats on fake-a-lakes by my self. So im always turning the water then climbing into the boat to fire up. On some occasions, I will shut the water off to do something, leaving the water running, then restart to further my tests.

With a sound engine, I do not see this being the cause, sorry.

Was the water in cylinders on one side, the other or both, all on one side or the other, random cylinders, etc? Rust trails? Was a compression test and then cylinder lead-down test done?

I agree. I asked this question of a trusted mechanic when I had my first boat. It's almost impossible for that to happen. I have a Perlo flush kit on mine which would basically be the same as a fake lake and have left it going for several minutes with no issues. These are not like jet skis.

[IDBoating]

I agree with the other respondents - highly unlikely that the water being on without the engine running caused water in your cylinders.

This IS a risk with marine engines that don't have an impeller water pump. A good example is jetski engines, where water is taken out of the pressurized area of the jetdrive for cooling. It is very important with engines like that to do the engine on - water on - water off - engine off sequence.

But on our boats, the engines have impeller pumps that draw a vacuum to get their cooling water. The hose pressure would have to force water past the impeller in the pump to even get into the cooling system at all. While theoretically possible, it's very unlikely.

I start my boat on the hose every Spring and Fall, by myself, and the hose runs without the engine running for quite a while as I make my way between the hose bib on the house and the boat out in the street. I suspect most people do it exactly that way, and you just never hear of this happening.

[boardman74]

Pretty easy to test right? Just have him pull the plugs and crank over to get any water out of the cylinders. Put fresh plugs back in a repeat what you did when you started it and see if you get water in the cylinders again. If you do and are still not convinced it is/isn't the house, go drop it in the lake and see if you get water in the cylinders.

I agree with the others, pretty slim chance its from the hose. Need to keep looking in the engine to find the real cause.

[GUY_RPM]

Would bad manifold gaskets allow water into piston area? I am going to get risers and manifolds pressure checked tomorrow. He has ordered new gaskets.

[gasoline_24]

I have some pretty good experience with this. Last year I replaced my second motor in 6 mos. because of water in the engine. I no longer have the boat. I thought each time we figured out the problem, but the guy who bought the boat had the same problem again last year. I think the first time I had a leaking exhaust.

The exhaust is hard to determine if you have a leak without something to pressurize the exhaust. A quick way to check without such a system is to block off one end of the exhaust or set them in such a fashion that you can fill them up and level them off to make sure they are holding fluid. Instead of water fill them with acetone. Acetone is thinner than water and will seap through any crack or failed gasket and you will be able to see it leak through. You can leave overnight and see if it maintains the level, but it does evaporate quickly.

On my first engine this was the problem and I purchased a new block and exhaust. The second engine also got a better set of exhaust manifolds, but that was not the fix. We thought it was the fake a lake as well, but that was not it. The next time occurred on the lake. That boat had captains call exhaust which now appears to be the problem. On that boat it was always coming into the even side of the engine.

When you had it running in the driveway was the front end jacked up quite a bit? This would explain the water ending up in the rear cylinders if I understood you right.

I would try the acetone test and see what that shows. This can be a common problem. What kind of water are you on?

[TeamAllen]

Pretty easy to test right? Just have him pull the plugs and crank over to get any water out of the cylinders. Put fresh plugs back in a repeat what you did when you started it and see if you get water in the cylinders again. If you do and are still not convinced it is/isn't the house, go drop it in the lake and see if you get water in the cylinders.

I agree with the others, pretty slim chance its from the hose. Need to keep looking in the engine to find the real cause.

With that theory you could just leave the plugs out, let the water run on the fake-a-lake and water should be running out of the spark plug holes?

[GUY_RPM]

My game plan is new gaskets, pressure test risers and manifolds, put back together and do as TeamAllen suggested. I like his theory as it should not hurt the motor if it gets water in the cylinder again. It seems simple. If it passes this test then plugs in and run it for a very short time then pull plugs and check for water. If it passes both of these test then it is time for a true water test. It's not quick but I think it will be effective. U guys have been a great help.

[boatwakes]

UNPLUG THE FUEL PUMP AND IGNITION COIL!!!!!!!!! If its a mercruiser, coil will have grey and black connectors overlapping each other, lift the lock and remove the grey one and the black will follow. Fuel pump will have a two wire harness, red and black, that is at the fuel pump rear, not the boat rear, disconnect it. You'll know you got the right one when you don't hear the fuel pump prime with the key "on".
If it's PCM, same principle applies, just disconnect the coil and fuel pump.
- Do a compression test first, you need to have numbers. Most of our head/engine replacements that occur from water ingested through the manifolds or leaking riser gaskets will hang an exhaust valve and bend pushrods or make contact with a piston. People don't know it's occurring until they get a rough running engine or lack of power. You've got to get numbers first in order to make sure you have compression. All need to be within 10%, so if you find one thats 15% different, that should raise your eyebrows but 30% difference or more needs to be addressed.
- Do a compression test.
- Separate the riser from the exhaust manifold and perform a visual check of the inside of the manifold and riser where they join. A leaking riser GASKET will show a rusty water telltale from it's point of origin at the mating surfaces and follow the walls of the manifold to the lowest point.
- A failed CASTING will show rust inside the riser from its point of origin.
- An engine REVERTING water will show rust all over the inside of the riser And manifold in rusty droplet form.
If your engine has a stuck open exhaust valve, it will create enough suction that it can actually suck water back in to the cylinder (revert) at low rpm.