Purchased 2009 Z1 and Engine Issues before it hits the water?

[dmbisbest]

Hello Fellow Tige Owners,

I purchased a 2009 Z1 w 140 hours on it in January. Prior to purchasing, I spoke to the dealership in the state that I bought it and their quotes were "we winterized it", "have always done the service on it", "everything is really clean", "it is in almost new condition", etc. (Of course, I did not get any of that in writing).

So now I took it to my local dealership to get it un-winterized and there are major issues with the engine. When they had it in the shop, it idled rough and felt underpowered. So they took it to the lake and could only get it to a top speed of ~25 mph. When they got it back to the shop, the oil was cloudy and they immediately thought cracked block. They have pulled the engine and the block seems to be ok. Now they are doing a little more testing and planning to resurface the heads, etc. I am already $3000 into this little endeavor and the issues were most likely caused by poor winterizing (which was always done by the dealer).

Now (for those that have stuck w this long post) do I have any recourse? What would you guys do? I am sick to my stomach that I have spent a great deal of money on a boat that is f-ed from the beginning.

Thanks for reading guys.

[Rossterman]

Did you pay the dealer out of state to do a transfer inspection? If so, you may have some recourse but since it was done some time ago, they likely will do nothing.

[boardman74]

Very few people commission a proper/true marine survey on wake boats. Its not the norm on this type of boat. I think you went farther than most by talking to the dealer that has serviced the boat. Most people don't go that far. Did you test the boat at all prior to purchase? If not did the seller offer any type of proof the boat was ok? Is there receipts from the service and winterization? If the dealer winterized the boat I would contact the seller and have him get you a receipt if you don't already have one. There is no reason he shouldn't help you resolve this if the dealer did the work the fault is with them and not the seller. If you have a proof the dealer did the winterization and the issue is due to that they should be liable. I know an issue from talking before is also going to be the distance away you bought it.

[dom w. forte]

Im not comfortable with the dealer who is working on the boat now, why would he pull the engine without further dignostics, or he did more and you havent given us all info , if power was down there should be more dignostic info like low compression on 1 or more cly, water coming out of a cly, etc.
Why is he surfaceing the heads which would indicate engine badly overheated?

[rwdavis1]

I feelyour pain. I purchased with the guarantee from the owner along with service records that all was in order. When having it de-winterized I have holes rusted through the manifolds on both sides. After knocking paint off the trailer I am having it replaced also. Ballast install was wrong as well as stereo. All of this my fault for not checking it out better and tusting someone elses opinion. I looked into recourse but with a private sell and no actual bill of sale with warranty specifications there is no recourse. Hugh lesson learned. Good luck man. When its fixed a beer and surfin your a** off seems to help.

[boardman74]

RW that sucks, but you are correct there is usually no recourse with a private seller. As is where is and buyer beware. I think the OP only chance is with the dealer that winterized the boat if there is paper work for that. I think from a legal stand point technically the seller would have to go back after the dealer as they are the one who had the work done and paid for it. Thats a lot of work for a guy who already has your money and lives 1000 miles away. Pretty easy to just not answer the phone.

Dom, his boat is sitting at a very reputable top 10 Tige dealer. Their service department is top notch and they do things the right way. The place has been is business(not always Tige) for over 100 years and I know many people who are lifelong customers. I think its pretty poor form by you, as another dealer, to immediately try to run down the dealer who I know for a fact is working hard to help the OP.

[dmbisbest]

RW that sucks, but you are correct there is usually no recourse with a private seller. As is where is and buyer beware. I think the OP only chance is with the dealer that winterized the boat if there is paper work for that. I think from a legal stand point technically the seller would have to go back after the dealer as they are the one who had the work done and paid for it. Thats a lot of work for a guy who already has your money and lives 1000 miles away. Pretty easy to just not answer the phone.

Dom, his boat is sitting at a very reputable top 10 Tige dealer. Their service department is top notch and they do things the right way. The place has been is business(not always Tige) for over 100 years and I know many people who are lifelong customers. I think its pretty poor form by you, as another dealer, to immediately try to run down the dealer who I know for a fact is working hard to help the OP.

Thanks for all the help guys. Pretty much reconfirming what I thought... Its not a good situation but the seller has been very responsive thus far and we literally spent hours and hours on the phone before the transaction went down. I do trust him. Once I get the exact situation, I will post more of the story to see if we can put the pieces together one way or another.

[dmbisbest]

I completely understand what you are saying... Feel like a dumb-a$$ for buying a boat that I never tested in the water. In my haste to get "a good deal", I thought I could buy over the winter, save a few bucks and be out on the water by early May. Good luck and beer does help.

[boardman74]

It sucks for sure. I'm picking mine up this week, so I will be happy to come give you a pull and test out that new lift!!

[Rossterman]

Not sure that is correct on not doing surveys for ski boats. I took a boat to MC dealer and for $295 they did a full transfer inspection specifically per a standard transfer process they offer on MCs. Using a form from MC with a very thorough check on everything down to the horn and all the checks w/ comments on what was found. Compression test, verification of hours in the ecu vs. guage. Even remarked on a water stain and measured to determine where water level was in the bilge. They also only release the boat when old & new owner sign off to prevent any thing funny. Steering cable was tight (which the owner had already said was nearing replacement) and they recommended replacing. Everything else was OK and it all worked out fine.

[boardman74]

I said it wasn't very common to have a survey done on a used ski/wake boat. Never said it could not be done or that some haven't done it. How many reading this had a marine survey done on their used wake/ski boat? An actual marine survey by a licensed surveyor, not a simple inspection at a dealer.

That sure isn't the norm here. I don't hear of many doing surveys. Just usually on the big river boats. Having a dealer check the engine or look it over isn't as uncommon. How can the dealer not release a boat they are simply inspecting and have no ownership of? That sounds really odd. Now if the dealer was selling the boat on consignment that might make sense as now their reputation is involved. But if you simply took it to them for a pre-purchase inspection how could they "not release it" for any reason. They would have no ownership or legal authority to hold it, unless maybe nonpayment of the inspection fee.

[Rossterman]

The release is signed by both parties and the inspection is paid for by the new owner. I'm sure if a lawyer got involved and the original owner paid for the inspection it would be released to the original owner. Just mainly done to prevent seller from backing out of the deal because of a better offer midway through the process. I had a signed contract stipulating purchase price and contingent on my approval of inspection which would carry more weight in court. Never needed it and the PO was a real stand up guy. He contacted the dealership after I took him to my bank and had them cut a cashiers check in front of him so he knew it was legit and I went over and picked up the boat.

The intent of my post was to make folks aware that these services are offered and folks should take advantage and use them. Here in California, boats sell so quickly at a good price that most folks aren't going to get the option of a water test (unless lake is very close) Which most arent in norcalmanyway. When the owner has 4 or 5 folks interested, they arent too inclined to do a water test especially if a buyer is willing to forgo. whether or not you water test, having an Inspection should be done is a good investment....

[Rossterman]

Hopefully things will be resolved soon for the original poster.

[NICKYPOO]

Why is he surfaceing the heads which would indicate engine badly overheated?

This is what I'm wondering. Poor winterization doesn't warp heads. Heat warps heads. That is surely a possibility for the mixing of oil and water. I've seen it happen. The two just don't go hand in hand. To my knowledge at least.

Just because a dealers has been in business forever doesn't make them the best, it means they are profitable. There's a laundry list, both good and bad of why that could be. There are dealerships that are honest and fair and there are dealerships that have become professional con artists. Just saying.

[ChrisBarnes05-12-84]

Ive accidently let my engine freeze on my old Boat. It sucks and is very expensive. I'm sorry someone would sell the boat to you in that condition. Hopefully issue gets resolved soon.