Tige Z3 vs Malibu Surfgate

[Moki]

Anybody have any experience surfing both the Tige Z3 and a Malibu equipped with the Surfgate. Is the Malibu wake just as good or just more convenient? Malibu has a patent pending on the design, so I don't think that we will see the other companies duplicate it unless they figure out how to get around the patent laws.

[Timmy!]

I think you should go surf them both and report back!

[duffymahoney]

From what I have read, the wave isn't amazing. But it's a good wave. So if you are looking for a ok-good wave that is push of a button and 15 seconds then I think the malibu is a great idea.

[Timmy!]

From what I have read, the wave isn't amazing. But it's a good wave. So if you are looking for a ok-good wave that is push of a button and 15 seconds then I think the malibu is a great idea.

15 seconds AFTER you fill the ballast. Everyone seems to forget that tiny detail. All the surfgate does is allow you to weight the entire boat for wakeboarding and the flip a switch for which side you want to surf. So if you have a mix of regular/goofy riders, it makes it convenient to go from one side to the other quickly.

[kko]

15 seconds AFTER you fill the ballast. Everyone seems to forget that tiny detail. All the surfgate does is allow you to weight the entire boat for wakeboarding and the flip a switch for which side you want to surf. So if you have a mix of regular/goofy riders, it makes it convenient to go from one side to the other quickly.

ASKING...Is that stock ballast or are they adding custom surf ballast? Its neat how you can switch but if you have an extra 1500# around all day, Is it really worth it. If your talking rnning 1500-2000# total ballast and having a great wave then I think it would be better. The down isde to surf gate seems to be having to carry extra ballast all the time. But if the total is no more than your avg. wakeboard weight then it wouldnt really matter I guess. Just use more fuel and work eng/trans a little harder.
Question... Why has the instafill type system really not caught on. Seems to me its the easiest way to move a bunch of ballast in a hurry?

[houstonshark]

The problem I see is, what fit you don't wakeboard with full rear ballast? I use 0 ballast in the rear for my 4yr old and maybe 25% for myself and wife most of the time. Yesterday we had a few more people on the boat than normal and used 0 rear ballast. I know that's not the case for all boats but it still seems like a lot of time and work (not to mention gas) to have to fill both rear sacs.

I'm not knocking Surfgate at all. I think it's a great innovation and should provide a consistent wake every time. If you have a mix of regular and goofy riders, I definitely see the benefit.

Based on some of the videos I've seen, the Z3 is a better wake. I would demo both and would be more interested in the overall boat comparison. If you like the convenience of the gate, I'm sure we'll see some very refined DIY options, if not factory options before too long.

Since it is basically just a trim tab, I'm sure there will be easy ways around the patent. How cool would it be to have a tab that's built into the hull that slides in and out in order to lengthen the hull on either side. That almost seems like it would give you greater adjustability. Man, that's a good idea...I'll be right back, I'm going to draw it up on a napkin and submit it for a patent!

[duffymahoney]

My 2005 24v wave destroys surfgate all day long

[ragboy]

The problem I see is, what fit you don't wakeboard with full rear ballast? I use 0 ballast in the rear for my 4yr old and maybe 25% for myself and wife most of the time. Yesterday we had a few more people on the boat than normal and used 0 rear ballast. I know that's not the case for all boats but it still seems like a lot of time and work (not to mention gas) to have to fill both rear sacs.

I'm not knocking Surfgate at all. I think it's a great innovation and should provide a consistent wake every time. If you have a mix of regular and goofy riders, I definitely see the benefit.

Based on some of the videos I've seen, the Z3 is a better wake. I would demo both and would be more interested in the overall boat comparison. If you like the convenience of the gate, I'm sure we'll see some very refined DIY options, if not factory options before too long.

Since it is basically just a trim tab, I'm sure there will be easy ways around the patent. How cool would it be to have a tab that's built into the hull that slides in and out in order to lengthen the hull on either side. That almost seems like it would give you greater adjustability. Man, that's a good idea...I'll be right back, I'm going to draw it up on a napkin and submit it for a patent!

That's the thing, to make a good surf wave, you need more weight in the back. When I took out Raquel Hoffman on the Z3, I emptied the rear surf system that we have "expanded" to be close to stock to match the 1000 lbs of front ballast we had. The wake was great. If you look at the TransWorld Z3 video with Errington and Ruck, they have a huge 1100 or so bag on the floor in the middle and then another 500 or 750 up front? That is massive, but a balance that favors wake boarding, not surfing.

The surfgate is definitely an amazing idea for all of those people that want to wakeboard and then have a chill surf session at the end of the day or when its choppy. I would still love to get a bunch of various wakesurfers behind it, surfers that surf first and know what a good wake feels like.

[movinup]

Just a question so please don't FLAME me on this.

Has anyone making comments that owns a Tige on this forum actually rode behind a Malibu with a Surf Gate?

We are about to upgrade our boat from a Stern to a V Drive (Malibu, X45, Supra and considering a Tige)

Just asking a simple question here.

Has ANYONE rode the wake or are we all just speculating, since this is a Tige forum???

Thanks.

[Ewok]

Most here are speculating, there are a very few on this site who are into BUs and they will let us know what it's really like.

Ok guys, let's be fair, there is not any significant difference waiting to fill up a huge surf side sac than filling up average factory sacs on both sides for wakeboarding. The main difference for surf gate is that you can fill up both sides, no list, switch sides faster than filling and draining sacs and it's probably a faster transition from wakeboarding to surfing and vice versa with surf gate than filling and draining to get the optimum wakeboard or surf setup. There should not be any more gas being used due to the surf gate compared to a listed boat, it's not the tab displacing the water, the ballast in either boats is doing that, the tab just cleans up the face of the wave.

For most serious wakesurfers, they will eventually ride the wave and let us know what it's like. It's a great idea and my wife is very impressed with how fast it is to switch sides, since she is goofy and I'm regular, but we are not going to sell our boat and get a BU because of surfgate. I hope to see one on the water someday and get to ride the wave, it looks fun. Which is better? It depends on you I guess, before buyin I would get out on the water and try both the z3 and surfgate and see which one you like better. I only hope that it gets more wake boat tubers to try surfing and get the tubes off the lake.

Just kidding tige tubers, my kids will probably want one soon

[turbonine]

In regards to weighting, the RZ and Z series are very sensitive to forward/aft weight and generally require ALOT of weight in the nose to wakeboard. Malibus generally are the least weight sensitive in terms of weighting, and tend to be nose heavy in the 23+ footers.

All the people that have rode surfgate firsthand have had the boat weighted in a way that you could also wakeboard board behind with no changes.

Can surfgate produce a pro level, competition surf wake? No one knows yet. My guess is probably not.

[talltigeguy]

A quote today from Malibucrew.com:

Just to add flame to the fire:

"So my buddy bought the much hyped tige z3. I talked him into getting the wake makers 1400 lb custom bag for it. We surfed both back to back for several days. My boat is an 11 lsv. Both boats have the 6 liter motors, and acme 1235 props. Both boats were weighted close to the same. Hands down everybody liked the Malibu boat's wave better ! Why does the the wake surfing community always snub their nose at malibu? On the lighter side, I get to demo a surf gate lsv this week! They told me I could bring a few fat sacs along. I will give my thoughts on this later this week."

This is the second guy this week to say the same thing. The LSV in question did not have surfgate, as it comes only on 2013's. I suggested in the first thread that he send his friend over to Tigeowners to see what he must be doing wrong and he said that the guy has it just like Ragboy's recipe.

BTW...what happened to the first several Z3 boats that were the 'first generation'? That hull needed some tweaking, to say the least, and I wonder if those are out there still. I wonder if that might be one explanation for the above observation.

[Timmy!]

Maybe they had too much weight in the wrong places for the Z3. You don't need a 1,400lb custom bag in the Z3, that's probably too much weight in that back corner for it.

[Moki]

I have surfed behind a Malibu, but not one with a surf gate. The wake wasn't as steep as a Tige and I struggled to keep up with a traditional board. In fairness, he did not have as much weight as my Tige. My impression is that the wake seemed more geared to a skim board. There are several things that does make me interested in the surf gate: The lack of list required to get a surf wake. It sounds as if the boat doesn't list at all, the Z3 was a big improvement in not requiring as much list. Secondly, how easy it is to switch between regular and goofy. It is only an issue when we have guests as our whole family is goofy (in more ways than one). Lastly, you don't have to change seating positions.

[ragboy]

If you put a 1400 lb bag in the corner of the Z3 it won't make a great wake. And if you only fill that corner, like many would thing, it will be horrible.