HD Rumble in the Rockies - Chevy wins

[chpthril]

Let me ask you a question:

Why do all cars have VIN #'s? Why does you dodge have a VIN#? And why is it different then others?

You guys think that Ford Makes 1 F250 Calibration for all trucks across the Country or World?

When my dealer orders my truck it will show up at FMC as a Florida Truck there for have calibrations and software for Florida or Southeast USA. If you live in california GOD Knows what will be different on your truck and you calibrations. Therefore we have a real need for VIN#'s. If i say i need a computer for my truck they will most likely have 10 different computers for an 05 F150, so they will need my VIN# to know which computer I need. Therefore what i meant was the truck must have the Colorado or Mid USA software and calibrations. Which it does since purchased in that state from a lot. So I would say #1 that ford needs to run a few more tests and change there calibrations for that area of the Country if even necessary with the proper gearing.



Maybe its not a package. I just called it cuz i dont know what it would be called. But now that i think about it it would have already had this since it was purchased form a local dealer. So in my earlier point i will have to take that out and only say the gearing and other specs.

Being that the Ford didnt have a flash for high altitude is negligible as both truck came off dealer lots in Motor City MI.

Page 7 baby

[Timmy!]

Im on it. Might take longer then this afternoon since its already 4:30 here I will need to talk to my local Ford Peps.

Ok. That's cool! Good luck!

If you do find something, I think it should be brought to the Pickuptrucks.com's attention as that would kind of invalidate the point of their tests.

[91Terminator]

Being that the Ford didnt have a flash for high altitude is negligible as both truck came off dealer lots in Motor City MI.

Page 7 baby

I said that already.

[91Terminator]

Ok. That's cool! Good luck!

If you do find something, I think it should be brought to the Pickuptrucks.com's attention as that would kind of invalidate the point of their tests.

I already said that its invalid and ford needs to go back and re calibrate for your area's trucks.

[Timmy!]

You are the man!

[chpthril]

I said that already.

I'm saying your argument that the Ford didn't have a high-altitude is negligible, not the test.

[91Terminator]

I'm saying your argument that the Ford didn't have a high-altitude is negligible, not the test.

And yes i already said that, but they test is still BS for other variables. As they all are Even the tests on Ford's Factory Web Site that shows them on top are complete BS.


Either way you will all be saying ford rules for a week by tuesday of next week so ha ha ha.

if you will allow me to use 2010 Models. Here is why: the 2011's are so new that most dealers dont even have service manuals for them. So if i can use a 2010 F250 with all the same specs form Fl and one from Colorado with all the same specs it will still prove they have different computer software and Computer Serial Numbers will prove this.

I would use 2 2011's but the Dealership will not be familiar enough with them and know enough yet to do this.

So will the 2010's work with you?

I can also use my 2003 Cobra since i am currently in need a of computer for it. All cars made and sold to different area's have different software.

[Timmy!]

Were they 2010's in the test? NO! 2011's man, sorry. I don't know much about Ford's but I know that GM's do not have different software from the factory per region. I've compared the program in my Vette to others around the country and they are identical.

[chpthril]

Were they 2010's in the test? NO! 2011's man, sorry. I don't know much about Ford's but I know that GM's do not have different software from the factory per region. I've compared the program in my Vette to others around the country and they are identical.

I concur. From my days with GM, I do not recall choosing a re-flash based on region. Except some for CA due to different emission specs from the rest of the states, but not regions or sea level or high altitude.

I think this test was as fair/even as possible. It was done by pickuptruck.com, not Ford or Chevy. Ford was invited to participate, but declined. This test was spurred by Ford owners who did not like the results of the 3/4 ton shootout. So I guess the old saying still rings true "be careful what you wish for, you just might get it".

Again, i'm not trying to rub these results in anyone's face. I have owned and worked on fords and chevys. I would own either of these two trucks, as it would come down to ride and features. MHO is that there is no argument here.

I would also love to see the ford camp reaction if the ford had the 3.55 gear and still fell behind the chevy. Would they, and you, then argue that they had the wrong gear on purpose and it needed the 3.73

[91Terminator]

I concur. From my days with GM, I do not recall choosing a re-flash based on region. Except some for CA due to different emission specs from the rest of the states, but not regions or sea level or high altitude.

I think this test was as fair/even as possible. It was done by pickuptruck.com, not Ford or Chevy. Ford was invited to participate, but declined. This test was spurred by Ford owners who did not like the results of the 3/4 ton shootout. So I guess the old saying still rings true "be careful what you wish for, you just might get it".

Again, i'm not trying to rub these results in anyone's face. I have owned and worked on fords and chevys. I would own either of these two trucks, as it would come down to ride and features. MHO is that there is no argument here.

I would also love to see the ford camp reaction if the ford had the 3.55 gear and still fell behind the chevy. Would they, and you, then argue that they had the wrong gear on purpose and it needed the 3.73

Number one the ford camp will always have an excuse same with the chevy same with the dodge same with toyota same with everyone.

I could care less who wins. I have done my research and test drives and I feel the Ford Truck line is best. So no need for any of these tests in my mind.

All i am saying is that most of these tests arent apples to apples on purpose. This one i do not believe was but it could be after all. Just cuz Pickuptrucks.com put this test on doesn't mean its fair and it was sponsored by GM, any sponsor in anything has a big say in it, just like a sponsor of a wake tourny they want there name on everything and boldy and highly spoken of.

Also, you dont choose the reflash, no customer does, If you buy a lot truck or order a truck from your local dealer it will have that area's flash in it from day one. If i bought a FL truck new and moved to arizona my truck would run ok for a few weeks then start acting up. I would then go to Ford to find out why they would eventually ask me if i have permanently moved here, then reflash my computer.

[Ewok]

Does Tige or PCM provide different firmware or software for their engines for different regions?

[dom w. forte]

I dont care whos truck performed better, dont own either brand , however i dont agree that all vehicles sold in different regions are calibrated the same, normally the vehicles leaveing the factory go to a region that it is calibrated for.
We have hundreds of tsbs for drivabilty issues , some are for cars that have moved down from up north and need to be reflashed new data. When you have a drivabilty issue first item is vehicle vin, and engine calibration number if ledgable.
I agree that the sensors are the same and that the comanded items are the same , but what the computor does with the imput is determined by program and their is a multitude of different fuel and ignition curves , or in the case of a diesel injection timing and preasure and boost.
I asked in an earlyer post if they did any data in the test on fuel economy for the 2 trucks during the test because I wanted to see if one truck performed better due to a different fuel curve which might show up in its fuel consumtion, to lean or rich can effect overall performance.
A comparison of each engines rpm at any particular speed can be effected by the calibrations and the optimun torque comes into effect on where that manufacturer wants his truck to perform the best.
I to however dont put much value in any test unless an independent test is organized asking all involved , bring us the best you got heres what were going to do and you have to meet all regulations as far as emissions, also fuel economy has to factor in on the equation because this would put pressure on any company to squeeze as much performance as possible but not want to sacrifise to much and loose on consumption.
And if a company doesnt want show thats their problem but dont go and provide the vehicles that you believe are equal, just let that manufacturer get a black mark for a no show.

[chpthril]

Also, you dont choose the reflash, no customer does, If you buy a lot truck or order a truck from your local dealer it will have that area's flash in it from day one. If i bought a FL truck new and moved to arizona my truck would run ok for a few weeks then start acting up. I would then go to Ford to find out why they would eventually ask me if i have permanently moved here, then reflash my computer.

My statements above were not from the consumer's side, but from the factory trained technician, working in a dealer service department, using the factory supplied Tech-II, and pulling the new flashes right off of GM's computer software. I dont remember ever seeing anything about regions.

Many of the vehicles i worked on were transplants from other areas. When a new car dealer picks and buys his new cars, they are sent to him out of the fleet of new cars already built and sitting in the manufacturers lot. The VIN's are chosen based on the options he wants, not the region he is in. These cars/trucks are already built. They do not send a guy around to re-flash a thousand cars a day based on where they are going, once a dealer buys them. Also, lots of the used cars on a dealers lot come from auction. These auction vehicles are coming from all over, and no one is reflashing them, either before they roll through the auction lane or after they are delivered to the new selling dealer.

So, i'll stand behind my statement.

If no one cares, how in the heck did we get to 7 pages about how the test was rigged, wasnt fair, bought and paid for Chevy, wrong reflash, etc, etc, etc?

Piece out!

[Timmy!]

GM asked Ford directly for the matchup and they respectfully declined (I would too unless I had done the test on my own to see where I stood).

I spent a lot of time on tuning forums and have never seen this on the GM side. I haven't tuned my Mustang as it is stock so I don't know about Ford, maybe they do that.

[Timmy!]

One more thing, I went and searched dealer inventory for F350 with dual rear wheels here in Denver and ALL of them had 3.73's for the rear gear. On the SRW versions it's all over the board, some have 3.31, 3.55 and 3.73. So that's all they would have been able to get had they bought the truck in Denver.