New 2007 RZ2 owner - Automated Ballast System vs Ronix Eight.3 Telescope Ballast Bags

[jbgp1200]

Hey Guys,

First post, completely new guy here. Former Moomba Owner (I know I know, but it was a good deal on a first boat) however, yesterday we just pulled the trigger on a pristine, perfectly maintained, always stored indoors 2007 Tige RZ2 with only 66 hours on it. After months of shopping and a little negotiating on this one I think we got a really fair deal on it.

The boat has no Ballast system which will be the first modification we tackle. From what I have read this isn't all that bad of a situation and it seems that starting with a clean slate may be the preferred method by some. After reading the forum for the past two weeks and trying to discover the best way to go about what to install for a ballast system my head spinning. Tons of great advice but I still am unsure what I need to do. I PM'd chpthril this morning and I am sure just as I have seen with everyone else he will be able to offer some great advice.

Any suggestions are appreciated but I do have a few specific questions.

1. How bad is the imperfection in the surf wave with the 2007 swim platform? Will I need to buy a later model swim platform or is it tolerable?

2. Ive seen someone mention that they prefer to use zero ballast he bow on the RZ2. Thoughts on this? Do I even need to drill holes and plum a bow ballast or should I just get a loose 600lb sac and a tsunami pump in case I feel like I need it?

3. Now for the question that is probably gonna make waves. Has anyone ever used the new Ronix Eight.3 Telescope bags and pump in instead of a fully automated system? As much as I would love to save a couple thousand dollars I am 99% sure I will just spring for a fully automated ballast system. However the new Ronix Telescope bags an pumps are appealing. They seem to fill up incredibly fast, while offering flexibility, cost savings

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYDALegB5Fo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AT69pSK3E3E
http://www.wakemakers.com/eight-3

Pros from what I can tell;
- Much faster to fill and drain. 2-3 minutes.
- No Holes drilled
- Less equipment usually means less failure. Pump fails just get on Amazon prime and get a new pump in 2 days that I don't have to install.
- Fill and drain from goofy to normal in minutes.
- Flexibility of being able to use the opposite bag on the seat if its Just my wife and I giving me the option of 2200lbs on one side which could probably sink the boat.
- Easily remove the bags for cleaning or to dry out the lockers.
- Cost is a fraction of a fully automated system. 2 x 1100Lb sacs $520 + 1 X 600lb bow sac $300 + 2 x Pumps (In case 1 fails) $320 = Total system $1140

Cons;
Obviously dealing with a manual pump.

Weight is weight so I'm certain the boat would perform just as well with 2 1100lb sacs in the lockers. Possibly even better considering I would have the flexibility of up to 2200lbs on one side that I can move around. After typing this up I have convinced myself even more this might not be a bad option.

I know some will have strong opinions on this but please let me know your thoughts.

Thanks,
JB

[Ewok]

The speed and convince of a plumbed-in system (not automated ), will be obvious if you do the Ronix option first. Even though the Ronix pumps are really fast, it's a big PITA to have to play with the electric cord and hose and pump and set it up and drain it. Especially if you are going to switch sides for surfing. The cost savings is not that much either but you'll have to plan and price out a plumbed-in system to see the difference.

A plumbed-in system can fill as fast as the Ronix system, but you need to use much faster pumps, which are available. The major slowdown in the flyhigh sacs is the fittings on the bag. A large pump and 1 1/2" hose will get choked down at the inlet of the fly high bags. It's possible to use the Ronix bags or get custom fly high bags with bigger inlets to allow the increased flow from the bigger pumps.

I'd get in touch with Chpthrill and see what's available with bigger bag openings and see how you can get a pretty quick fill time with a plumbed in system.

In regards to bow weight, my RZ2 likes the 400lb bow sac full for surfing on either side, and sometimes I throw a 150lb bag up on the seat there too if I don't have many people on the boat. All the boats are slightly different and require a little bit of experimentation to get the wake dialed in just right, so your boat may be a little different than mine in how it likes to be weighted.

[Ewok]

Here is a 3800 gph pump you can use for a plumbed-in system, but it uses 1 1/2" hoses. They are big and it will take some creativity to mount them but it's possible and would fill a big 1100-1500 lb sac in 3-4 min, depending on the size of the sac and the plumbing, which is just as fast as the Ronix bag and pump.

http://store.waterpumpsupply.com/runo12vodcbi7.html

[Dandy]

Here is a 3800 gph pump you can use for a plumbed-in system, but it uses 1 1/2" hoses. They are big and it will take some creativity to mount them but it's possible and would fill a big 1100-1500 lb sac in 3-4 min, depending on the size of the sac and the plumbing, which is just as fast as the Ronix bag and pump.

http://store.waterpumpsupply.com/runo12vodcbi7.html

On a side note of the huge pumps, check out the AMP draw of a larger pump like this. 25 amps @ 12 VDC / 15.5 amps at 13.6 VDC. That is a lot of power draw and requires some significant wire.

Here is my 2 cents - if cost/time is a concern. I would work with Chp to see what bags he would recommend for your set up. Get these bags now and have them set up for use with portable pumps (possibly Tsunami). If you use Tsunami portable pumps, these could be optimized as one of your pumps or could be used as a back up. Try to design what you would do for an plumbed in system so that you can get the correct sacs as this is a significant part of the cost.

I just worked with Chp to pick up some sacs and portable pumps to add above my factory ballast. I ordered 2 of the pumps which would allow me to fill/drain both sides or if I want to list the boat some, I can drain one side while filling the other. The added $129 +/- for the extra pump doesn't seem too bad to speed up the time and the odds of having both fail the same day are slim to none, so I essentially have a back up. Should I like this set up and wish to plumb it in, I have the bags and either a fill or drain for each side already.

Good luck

[dukesofhazzard]

I am in the process right now adding ballast in 22ve and went through MLA. I have been on friends boats and I think or feel automated is the way to go even if it takes a little longer as it easier once setup and everything hidden. Press the switch and done. No hoses or cords etc. I am using reversible pumps. For me I wanted simplicity. Others like the rule style pumps. Can't remember name of them right now. But then u have to use 2. 1 for fill and one for empty. Talk to mike he will hook u up.

[mls6722]

My ballast takes 10 minutes to fill and a bit longer to switch sides. But all it takes to get started is to be in the water and flip a switch. The bigger pain is that we usually have ropes and life jackets in the side that isn't filled and move that stuff when switching. In reality, I have never felt that time is too long and we are usually ready for a short break when switching sides.
In theory, the fastest system sound great at the planning stage, but not really a practical issue IMHO.
That being said, I will likely add a crossover pump when I run out of other boat projects [emoji3]

[Ewok]

The amp draw on the Ronix pumps is probably similar to the amp draw on the Big Rule pumps, I have a feeling it's the same internals.

Either way, talk to Chpthrill to get a good handle on a plumbed in system. He can set you up with the perfect setup to balance you desired objectives (fill/drain/crossover time) vs your budget. You can plumb in lots of ideas but it comes at a cost.

[Greeko]

The ronix pumps are a bit of a pain to drain..You can never get all the water out of them...

Plumb it up! Talk to Mike at MLA

[chpthril]

Here are some questions to ask yourself:

Does the 8.3 have enough ports and in friendly locations, that will allow them to be plumbed in when you grow tired of manually filling?

Will the ACC socket handle the current draw of the 8.3 pump? I can almost guarantee then answer is no. The wiring to it may be borderline, but I bet the socket will not last a season.

1100 lbs in the rear surf side if an RZ2 is going to produce a good wave, but, the real locker of the RZ is not going to hold that. You will need an L shaped sac in order to get that weight. Depending on the 8.3 dimensions, you will likely net 800-900 lbs. Thats good if you got 5-6 peeps along also. Otherwise, you will need a 2nd sac.

[retox1]

I would recommend that you install an automatic system. In my last boat i manually filled everything all the time and it got annoying. I've never timed my sytem out but it probably takes 8-10 minutes to completely switch sides. Its a little longer than i'd like but we always just take a break and let the kids go for a swim or something and sit and BS for a bit. Someday i'll probably add another fill/drain pump for each side but this works good for now. As for bow weight, after playing around with my RZ2, it seems to like some front weight. Mine is the upgraded IBS and i fil it pretty full when we surf.

The factory 07-08 platform is huge and it will cause a problem on the wave. Lots of guys cut theirs down, or just make a new one. I played around with a few different sizes of platforms made out of cheap plywood and coated with spraycan bedliner. They held up surprisingly good and i found a shape that doesnt mess with the wave, is still useable, and looks good. For this year i'm making a half decent one out of plywood that i've fiberglassed a couple layers over and i'll probably get it LineXed next week. Cost me about $65 so far and depending on how it turns out, it may become permanent.

[jbgp1200]

Ok, well I'm convinced I should be going with a plumbed-in system. Thank you. You're right, depending on the kits its not much more money if you install it yourself. If not, it's another thousand bucks.

I'm a pretty handy guy who has been building and doing home improvements most of my life. I'm no stranger to a drill and I've also made my fair share of mistakes along the road with many projects. Fortunately for the most part every mistake I have made I have been able to learn from and correct. For some reason the possibility of incorrectly drilling holes in a boat has me a tad bit worried.

With that said, which pump kit should I consider?
http://www.wakemakers.com/wakemakers...st-system.html
http://www.wakemakers.com/kiss-compl...t-package.html
http://www.wakemakers.com/kiss-compl...t-package.html

I want to get the most weight I can in the back and it sounds like the largest bags I can get in the rear locker are about 750/800lbs. So if that's correct I'm either gonna need people or an extra bag and portable pump anyway.

The rear deck has me concerned. I know this isn't a newer 80k RZ2 but this boat still cost me a good amount of money. I know the problem can be resolved by trimming the deck, but again, we are carving up a beautiful boat and this has be a bit worried. Can I order a later model RZ2 swim platform and will it work on an 07? Hope I bought a boat that can help me create a great surf wake.

[retox1]

I run the Atwood 1200s and they work pretty good. It probably ended up being a little less expensive to go that way instead of the reversible pumps for me because i was reusing some factory wiring and switches. If you want to get the most room for sacs in the back you really need to move your batteries and taps actuator. Some guys move everything forward and some guys make a tray just aft of the engine. Then your sacs can fill all the way back to the transom. An 1100lb sac won't fill completely full but i think its over 900lbs for sure. You can also just get an enzo sac that fills under the seats as well. They're alot more cash, but way bigger. When it comes to ballast you should talk to Chptril (mike) on here. He's kinda the ballast guru around here and will get you set up.

Pretty sure you can get a newer platfom and i will work, but theyre expensive. Any decent fiberglass shop can cut down the factory one and make it look as good as new.

And don't worry about drilling holes and cutting up your boat. Your actually improving the boat when your doing all this stuff.

[Booms]

jbgp - when I bought our 08 RZ2 it had no ballast. I went with MLA as he knows his stuff and has great customer service. Check out my posts on here which will show you the ballast install, swim platform mod and the cooler removal. They might not be the best examples but those three projects gave me a killer wave.

http://www.tigeowners.com/forum/show...all&highlight=

Good luck and have fun with the install! You will measure 12 times before you core/drill a hole through your hull, but trust me it will be worth it.

[Timmy!]

I'm the one that doesn't like bow weight in my '07 RZ2. I just feel like it collapses the wave and takes away push on my boat. Your mileage may vary.

Good luck with the install! It's worth it to not have to plug anything in. If you're like me, you still have to move life jackets from side to side anyway so why have the extra hassle of plugging in pumps too?

[jbgp1200]

Talked to MiKe at MLA this morning. He is the process of getting me all set up.

Thank you all for your advice. I am certain ill have more questions soon.

JB