Ballast Install 24V - Thanks Mike (Chpthril)

[Stingreye]

I finished the bulk of my ballast install and have been wanting to put it up here. I read almost every ballast install thread on here and it was a ton of help. IMO, Tigeowners.com has the most comprehensive ballast install threads out there. I read a few on other websites but we are loaded with great content here. My install was not nearly as complex as others but maybe there will be some useful info for others.

If I had tried to build / buy a custom system from parts at the hardware store or marine store etc. It would have been a nightmare by not having my safety net, Mike (Chpthril) a phone call away.

The best thing I did was call Mike after reading about the glowing recommendations on here. I bought pretty much everything from Mike. He walked me through everything from design to finish. I would not hesitate recommending Mike's Liquid Audio to anyone.

When I first bought the boat, I was planning on filling manually with Tsunami's the first season. Well, two trips and the wife nixes that idea.

Sacs (All Fly high Fat sacs):
2 Rear Lockers - Jumbo W719 DIMENSIONS: 50 x 24 x 24 WEIGHT: 1100 lbs. / 500 kg. Sac is longer than compartment by 10". It is shorter than compartment. The rear lockers are REALLY deep.
2 Under Rear seat sacs - W705 DIMENSIONS: 60 x 26 x 10 WEIGHT: 650 lbs. / 295 kg. Fits really well. Thanks Duffy for posting your custom sac dimensions, it helped find a good underseat sac.
2 under bow seats - W701 - DIMENSIONS: 42 x 16 x 16 WEIGHT: 400 lbs. / 181 kg. each These don't fit the best but I already owned these and could re-use them. Seem to work ok. A longer sac might work a little better or the integrated bow sac.

Mike originally recommended Enzo's for the rear but at the time. I decided to go with separate rear locker sacs and underseat sacs because I was planning on manually filling the sacs and I thought I might want to move the opposite side sacs around if I had a small crew to get more weight. I thought it would give me more flexibility.

If I were to do it again. I would go with the Enzo sacks or custom sacs (Duffy sized ). I ended up tying the two rear sacs to the same switch so no benefit to me for the rear sacs.

Pumps -
6 sacs so 12 pumps
8 Atwood T800s
4 Atwood T1200s


I am going to break this post into multiple posts and hopefully there will be something useful out for someone else.

[Stingreye]

Funky old ballast system!

Nickypoo had mentioned in another thread about the benefits of a boat without a 10 year old funky ballast system. Well..... mine had the factory Ballast system from 2004.

The factory system had 2 rear hard tanks in the back locker that extended under the seat and 2 front tanks that were in the mid ship lockers.

Removing the tanks you pick up a lot of space when using sacs and they are empty. I also prefer to have the ballast under the bow seat instead of midship lockers because I find the storage in the midship lockers more useful.

Pic of rear lockers with (port side with battery).
IMAG0467.jpgIMAG0459.jpg

I moved the battery behind the rear false wall.


Factory System:

Fed by 1.5" transom thru hull
IMAG0472.jpg

Factory Pumps / Manfold
IMAG0466.jpg

Basically 4 500gph pumps in a pvc manifold.

A hose similar to the raw water intake hose, ran under engine to near the V-Drive where it connected to a PVC emergency shutoff.

The emergency shutoff was seized and could not be turned.

It had 3/4" hose lines to all the tanks and thru-hulls. It had a dedicated thru-hull for drain and vent.

I ended up removing the entire factory system and only keeping the switches. MY reasons:

1) Several of the hose barbs on the pumps were cracked or broken. They didn't leak but when I took off the hose you could tell see where they were broken.
2) Reusing the existing manifold with new pumps would be tough they were glued in.
3) Emergency shutoff was seized
4) Didn't like how shutoff wasn't directly connected to thru-hull.
5) My wife after hearing about "filling or adjusting on the fly", talked me out of attempting re-use any of the factory system.
6) I would be drilling the hull anyway to fit two more fill pumps for rear bags.


You can also see my boat was neglected and stored with a few inches of water in the bilge. So one of my "todos" is to clean up and protect a few areas where corrosion is present.

[Stingreye]

First obstacle

The first problem I ran into involved capping the rear factory intake.

Before:
IMAG0529.jpg
You can see the hose barb. The plan was to cut it off with my dremel cutting wheel and then simply thread a cap on.

After crawling back and managing to cut it off I saw this:

IMAG0531.jpg

The thru-hull had pipe thread notches cut into it which prevented me from using a cap to seal off the factory intake.....

Then I moved to plan b. Just replace the entire thru-hull. Mike supplied the replacement thru-hull and cap.

Again, the convenience of contacting Mike, describing the problem, and finding a solution was invaluable. Mike did his best to save me money but in the end I decided it was best to just replace this thru-hull. It came out remarkably easy using a pipe wrench on those cut threads.

IMAG0533.jpg

[Stingreye]

For the thru-hulls for the rear jumbo sacs and underseat sacs. They would share a thru-hull so I shouldn't need new holes. However, I would need increase from 3/4" hose to 1" for the Jumbo drains.

Another note: about 1/2 of my above water thru-hulls were broken and had been reclamped closer. It might be due to the torque from the hoses or tightening the clamp to much on factory system. Either way, I decide to replace all of my thru-hulls with new ones. I also went with the 90* ones from Mike because it make the hose runs a little cleaner.

Important point: Mike verified that the new thru-hulls could fit with enough horizontal clearance. The nut on the back is bigger than exterior mushroom. This is another area I was glad to have Mike helping with the design. He knew to check for that and that the nuts were the bigger "clearance" issue.

IMAG0522.jpg


I also found out that the new thru-hulls had a bigger diameter than the factory thru-hulls. So I had to open up the holes with a dremel. Opening up the holes is a bigger pain than drilling a new hole. Fiberglass powder everywhere. Recommendation wear a long sleeve shirt (I did not and had itchy forearms).

IMAG0549.jpg

[Stingreye]

I don't have any pics of the bilge with the new pumps installed. I will take one soon.

The one concern I had was that I put the thru hull for the new PVC manifold on the port side of bilge with a 90* elbow to the bronze ball valve then a 90* pvc to a manifold with 4 pumps.

The 90* off the bilge caused a slight downward path (not good) caused by angle of the hull. I rotated it slightly towards the front of the boat so it is not perpendicular to the boat but points slightly towards the front of the boat. I will try to take a pic. I was concerned about air lock on the manifold. Turned out not to be a problem. Unloading the boat off the trailer causes enough rocking to compensate for the very slight drop in elevation for that path. So no air lock and it works great.

The 1200 pumps have a ball valve and a T to connect. Its pretty crowded with it all but it all fits and works. I am able to reach the ball valves by removing one engine divider and reaching.

Another note. I really like the nylon clamps Mike uses on the sacs and fittings. I managed to throw out all my 3/4" nylon clamps when I was throwing out packing material and cleaning my garage. So I used the worm gears for 3/4" fittings (many from the factory system I just re-used) but I will go back and replace with the nylon fittings.

I would consider myself an average DIY'er at best. So ballast projects are very doable for those willing to invest the time and read the threads on this forum, and order ballast supplies from someone who will help you with their expertise.

At this point, I am really happy with it. Glad I did it and will just have a few minor tweaks left. Mike's expertise was awesome! Thanks again Mike!

[NICKYPOO]

This is why Mike is held in such high regard around here. You usually only hear about poor customer service from any given company. I've never heard one bad thing about Mike. Every comment has always been positive about his services. He is worth every penny.

Nice write up Stingreye. Looking forward to some wake pics.

[mnpracing]

I'll chime in here too. Mike is/was great to deal with when I ordered my upgrade goodies for my z3. Easy transaction and great responsiveness on questions as I was working through the install.

[Stingreye]

Thanks Nickypoo.

I am dying to get back out there and take some wake shots. I just added a horse stall mat and Acme 2133 so I am eager to see the results.

[IDBoating]

Suggestion when enlarging existing holes: Using a hole saw of the desired size, cut a hole in a waste piece of plywood or similar material. Then, securely tape that piece over the existing hole, with the new hole centered on the old one. Finally, cut the new hole by starting the hole saw in the hole in the wood. This provides a perfect template for the hole saw, since it was cut with the exact same tool. The hole saw won't "walk", and you'll get a perfectly round and smooth hole in less time than the usually ragged hole you get from trying to "enlarge" an existing hole with a Dremel or other tool.

[Stingreye]

Great tips waboating. Worse than the ugly holes is the powdered fiberglass everywhere. Plus I bet your method would be much faster.

[Bad05]

Nice post(s) Stingreye! I'm finishing up my goofy side install this year and will be switching to the nylon clamps as well. Mike of course has been guiding me through it as well!

[mnpracing]

Suggestion when enlarging existing holes: Using a hole saw of the desired size, cut a hole in a waste piece of plywood or similar material. Then, securely tape that piece over the existing hole, with the new hole centered on the old one. Finally, cut the new hole by starting the hole saw in the hole in the wood. This provides a perfect template for the hole saw, since it was cut with the exact same tool. The hole saw won't "walk", and you'll get a perfectly round and smooth hole in less time than the usually ragged hole you get from trying to "enlarge" an existing hole with a Dremel or other tool.

In the past, I've used a cork to stuff in the hole to use as a guide for the hole saw. Another option depending on what you have laying around the garage.

[NICKYPOO]

Actually, the easiest way to do it is to use two hole saws on the same pilot bit. One the size of the existing hole and one the size of the new hole.

[NICKYPOO]

Nice post(s) Stingreye! I'm finishing up my goofy side...

Do you mean port side?

[Stingreye]

Nickypoo, that method sounds great. I might experiment with a couple of those methods posted here to open up the rear locker wall hole bigger when I ran the drain line. I just want it bigger to help when I have to pull out the rear wall to work back there. I made the drain hose a tight fit there and I have had to pull the rear wall more than expected. That "plastic" or whatever its made out of rear wall melts when you cut it so trying to expand it would by a pain.

I forgot to mention that I also replaced my bilge thru hull. The factory bilge thru hull was MUCH nicer than what they used for the factory ballast system. I swapped it out for a 90* which lets you route the hose up and over the rear wall instead of through it. Looks cleaner and let me take out my rear wall without worrying about bilge hose.

Bad05, I think the nylon clamps you just can't appreciate until you use them and the worm gears side by side. Good luck with your install!