Installing Ballasts vs using fat sacs

[sonnynerik]

We are getting ready to purchase and pick up a 2008 22ve boat tomorrow. It seems like a great boat but we've never had a tige, nor a wakeboarding boat. I have 2 teenage boys that wakeboard and want to wakesurf. The boat doesn't have any ballast. Should we consider having the tige dealer install hard ballasts or should we just use fat sacs? If we opt for fat sacs, any suggestions on size and/or shape and where to put them in the boat?

Any last minute warnings or advice prior to purchasing the boat? It has 20 hours and is basically new. It looks amazing! The only issue is that one of the swivels on the samson rack doesn't lock into place. We're being told that they are having samson send out a replacement swivel (one that holds a wakeboard and surfboard... since the current only holds 2 wakeboards).

Also, any suggestions on a good wake surfing board for beginners?

[sonnynerik]

Boat without Ballasts???

One more question.... are we CRAZY for purchasing a boat without ballasts??? Especially considering we are planning to use it for wakeboarding and wakesurfing?

[Timmy!]

Congrats on the new boat! You're not crazy for buying one without ballast but for the surfing you will definitely want it. If you only need ballast for surfing, hit up chpthril (Mike) on here and order up the custom surf sac that the TO's have come up with and get a tsunami pump to manually fill. There are lots of ballast install threads here on the forum if you are comfortable at doing it yourself too. The factory ballast isn't really enough for wakesurfing and you would want an additional sac for the lockers to really get your wave going.

For the past 3 years we have just been using a pair of the fly high v-drive sacs and a tsunami pump and it has been sufficient (800lbs). This year we ordered the custom sac (1,000+) and it has just arrived so we get to test it out tomorrow. Your dealer should be able to hook you up with the v-drive sacs and a tsunami pump for $250-$300 or ask them to throw it into the deal(worth a try).

[Ewok]

BLUF: If you can afford it, have ballast installed by the dealer or other professional (or yourself if you handy).

I have had my RZ2 for about 4 weeks now and it has the basic factory ballast installed. Its very nice for wakeboarding and the convenience of hitting switches for ballast is awesome. I plan on installing some sort of surf ballast system this winter to give me the convenience of hitting switches. I used bags on my last boat and it can get a little difficult to fill them with a boat full of people especially if they are new to boats in general, and never wakesurfed or wakeboarded, which most of my friends are.

[sonnynerik]

Thanks so much for your replies. It helps! So, Timmy, if I understand correctly... you feel we need both the ballasts and custom surf sacs? Is it possible to hook up the custom surf sacs to the "buttons" on the dash. I noticed there are 2 extra buttons that aren't being used for anyting. They are labeled as "acc".. I assume that means accessory and that we can use them for items we add (like ballasts, etc).

Also, any ideas for a good beginner to intermediate wakesurf board?

[sonnynerik]

Also, I should note that when I say "ballasts" I am referring to the hard ballasts.

[jbort]

Sonnynerik - a few comments:

Congrats congrats congrats on the new boat - the fun is about to start.

U r not crazy for purchasing with no factory ballast - u r gonna pay for it in one way or another. Check out the ballast and wake surfing forums on this website for lots more info. When we surf we fill two rear hard tanks (500lbs) and then fill manually a 400lb fatsac via Tsunami 1200gph pump which works nicely in port side rear locker (also called v-drive locker i beleive) but like many things on a boat u always want more so we are gonna try a buddies custom 1100 lb sac when it arrives in Aug and see how that goes. We don t fill front sacs but gonna try after we gat back from current trip. Surfing takes a good amount of time to sort out but lots of fun. All items obtained from chpthril (Mike) who is on this board and super good guy.

Where r u? Other Tige owners might be available too coach also. Mike helped us on a trip down here last summer.

What ages? how much do the riders weigh? board selection is all over the map and I'm gonna let others comment since my board exposure is limited to Hyperlite broadcast which does decent job and Inland Surfer Venture (for wife) but I weigh 250+ and some big guys have different board issues.

Have fun

[Timmy!]

To start with you could get away with the hard tank ballast system but as you guys progress, you will most likely want more ballast for surfing so you can get a bigger wave and longer pocket. As an example, Tige now has a surf ballast option that has the hard tanks plus an additional sac that sits on top of it. You can definitely hook up the extra bags to the existing system and use extra switches on the dash.

As for beginner boards, you can go with one manufactured by a wakeboard company (CWB/Hyperlite/Ronix)($300) to get you started but you will outgrow those boards pretty quickly and once those boys get going they are going to need a "Real" surfboard ($500+). Ragboy and Surfdad on here are really the experts on board selection. Ragboy's site is: http://wake9.com and he really has extensive videos on how to get started, what board you might want, etc. I'm not going to steer you away from those "production" boards but I will tell you that you probably won't even find one rider on those boards in the wakesurf competitions.

[somebodyelse5]

Right on man, congrats with the boat! you are seriously gonna love surfing. ITs all we do now. Havent even put a wakeboard in the water in a few years.

Wave wise, the more weight the better. In our 02 20V we have an 1100# fat sack in the back locker, 3 7 gal fresh water jugs under the seats, 1 7 gal jug in the walkway, and 200-300# (i never new the size just guessing) under the Cushions in the bow. its a pretty solid wave, but still planning on using the 2 400# sacs we took out and replaced with the 1100#'s

Good luck and remember, weight in back adds height to the wave, weight up front adds length to the pocket. And the more weight, the faster you can go.

[sonnynerik]

Fat Sacs

Thanks so much to all of you that responded!
Here's the info you requested. My husband is about 200lbs, I'm approx 130 and my kids range from 50-95lbs (but continue to grow!!).

I think we will start with a liquid force or hyperlite wakesurf board and then adjust accordingly as we advance in the surfing world.

So, is it better to get the customized 1000 lb l-shaped fat sac that goes into the rear locker and under the seats... and just start with one for the surfing side of the boat?

Or, would you go with two 400-500lb sacs and put them both on the surfing side (when surfing) and one on each back side of the boat when wakeboarding? I'm hoping that the regular wake (using taps) and passengers will be good enough for wakeboarding for awhile. What do you all think? Whats been your experience with the wake (without fat sacks and ballasts) for boarders when they are just young boys (13 and 14 years old)?

Thanks!

[somebodyelse5]

It would depend on how crazy your kids are, I know when I was 15-16 (before I hurt myself) I was riding with the ballast full (2 400# in back, and 200/300# up front) plus people weight. But while they are learning you should be fine, once they progress they will want more.

You could just get the fly high 1100# fat sac and itll conform to the locker. heres mine

[chpthril]

Thanks so much to all of you that responded!
Here's the info you requested. My husband is about 200lbs, I'm approx 130 and my kids range from 50-95lbs (but continue to grow!!).

I think we will start with a liquid force or hyperlite wakesurf board and then adjust accordingly as we advance in the surfing world.

So, is it better to get the customized 1000 lb l-shaped fat sac that goes into the rear locker and under the seats... and just start with one for the surfing side of the boat?

Or, would you go with two 400-500lb sacs and put them both on the surfing side (when surfing) and one on each back side of the boat when wakeboarding? I'm hoping that the regular wake (using taps) and passengers will be good enough for wakeboarding for awhile. What do you all think? Whats been your experience with the wake (without fat sacks and ballasts) for boarders when they are just young boys (13 and 14 years old)?

Thanks!

To share some info on ballast sacs:

A custom sac is just about the best way to go. It will allow you to make use of just about the entire storage area where the sac is placed. The only real down side is that the customs are pricey as compared to a standard sac.

The next best alternative is to go with either a standard sac that will fill a given storage space as best it can, but sometimes, depending on the boat, you may need to supplement that sac with another. Downside to this is that often times, the extra sacs are on the seats or in the floor. Another thing to point out as well, when you add up the cost of two or three sacs, you may be close to the cost of a single custom. The plus side to multiple sacs, they can be redistributed for wakeboarding.

[somebodyelse5]

Heres the way!

[Wakemaker]

That is an awesome picture..........!

[Guapo]

I was in your shoes last year. I had never owned a wakeboard boat and really didn't know what I needed or would eventually want. My boat came with factory hard ballast tanks in the rear lockers. I quickly (at my 20 hour service) had my dealer add fat sacs and plumb them in with some new switches on the dash...so it would all be automatic. This was simply for surfing as none of us are good enough wakeboarding to worry about ballast for wakeboarding yet. At that time, we added 455# sacs in each locker.

Fast forward to this year. We are now trying some basic tricks while surfing and ended up "out growing" the 455# sacs, so I ended up buying a 1000# L shaped custom sac from Chpthril. Last weekend was the first weekend to use it and what a difference. Wish I had done it from the beginning. The great thing about all of this is that it's all plumbed in, controlled by switches on the dash and is all concealed (no sacs on seats, floors, etc.).

My point in saying all this is that since you do not have the factory hard tank ballasts, you will more than likely want as much fat sac ballast as possible for surfing...go big from the start and get the 1000# custom sac from Chpthril...you wont' regret it.

Boards...we started with CWB Ride. It's a great beginner board. Very easy to ride. We damaged it this summer and replaced it with a Hyperlite Broadcast (the shorter of the two lengths). Both are great beginner boards and you can still do some tricks on them. We have added some surf style boards since then, but the board that gets used the most in our boat is the Broadcast.

Just my